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Topic: Really universal soldering controller (Read 714169 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2865
. . .
Phasing out a transformer is pretty easy, basic stuff, no big deal even for a beginner.
How the beginner will realize existing of that stuff , to be able to take adequate action

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2866
How the beginner will realize existing of that stuff , to be able to take adequate action
I speak about 2 separate coils, for a 2x 12 V coil connected( 24V with a middle point ) is a different story, I will not even mention about  that.
What about to change D1-D4 with a double current specs and change a bridge rectifier with a Single diode ( effective Vin will drop to 17V for FETs and check firmware for corresponding AC sensing. Switching again with a relay and will save a lot of efforts.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2867
How the beginner will realize existing of that stuff , to be able to take adequate action
Well, such a beginner shouldn't even think of assembling this project in the first place. It's pretty advanced stuff. Anyway, if the project will adopt this feature, this should be mentioned in the readme/documentation.
What about to change D1-D4 with a double current specs and change a bridge rectifier with a Single diode
No difference with just switching upper FETs for every second half-period, but with more hassle.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2868
No, it senses rectified AC, there is nothing to do with any MCU supply filtering. There is some firmware filtering, but I didn't analyze what exactly FW is doing in this regard. And it actually don't have to be that strict. If adding such a feature, power lost detection could be just blocked for a couple of mains periods, forty odd ms should be plenty to switch a relay, and not even close to VDD dropping below brown-out threshold. It's somewhat half a second power lost message is held on the display prior it shuts down.
Phasing out a transformer is pretty easy, basic stuff, no big deal even for a beginner.

Yes, even 5year old kid can find winding beginnings and ends

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2869
No difference with just switching upper FETs for every second half-period, but with more hassle.
We will work on a half wave instead of full wave and I think definitely will have difference, the question is how precise will be PID for the 40W cartridges
. . .
And let keep away the kids from that project.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2870
We will work on a half wave instead of full wave and I think definitely will have difference, the question is how precise will be PID for the 40W cartridges

farther analyzing brought me to the conclusion that solution will work correct for the first channel only, the second one, will experience the same overshooting or if it some how work without overshooting, it will not be as stable as the first one.

That's mean one of fore mentioned methods should be used.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2871
Hey guys,

I know I am a bit late to start asking questions, but I am really stuck on the last issue. I started building the station like a year or more ago and did not finish it. Now, I wanted to finish it once for all. I am using a JBC T245 handle on the station with a C245 cartridge.

I have read most of the posts in this thread, there also were a few other people with the same issue, but either they didn't post their solution or their solution does not apply to me.

Issue: When I power up the station with handle and cartridge connected, the cartridge heats up, the displayed temperatur is stuck at room temperature. But, aperiodically the displayed temperature jumps up to like 40 or 60 degrees, but still far from the actual tip temperature (after 3 seconds the tip temperature should be well beyond 40°C or 60°C I guess...)

What I have tried so far:
  • Calibrating works without an issue.
  • I have double an triple checked my wiring. I cannot seem to find a mistake or problem. Just as an additional information, I have no idea if it matters: vout2+ and vout2- were mixed up before, but they should be correct now. Looking from the top on the Molex connector for the iron power: top left: vout1-, bottom left: vout1+, top right: vout2-, bottom right: vout2+. Could anyone please confirm this?
  • When in calibration mode and the tip + cartridge are connected, I do see an adc value. For room temperature it is barely above 0 (single digit), if I heat the tip up with a different soldering iron the value will rise. So I guess the TC in the cartridge is ok.
  • Its hard to tell, but when measuring the voltage at U16A:2, it seems to not rise above 153 mV. As I said, I'm not 100%ly sure about this one, because it's hard to measure only with two hands and an heating element running wild... I have not tried replacing D20 and C63. Maybe I should? But, I also assume that the 153 mV are due to the heating, and not due to the TC.
  • When powered down, Q2, Q8, Q10 and Q11 seem to be ok (few MOhms between D and S)
  • Obviously, tool detection works properly, if no cartridge is inserted into the tool, I get a "HEATER OPEN" message. The tool is correctly shown as JBC C245

I have not tried reversing the TC polarity on the connector. But, I also haven't found the reason sparkybg gave why it should not be connected the other way round, like for the C210. Can anyone point me to a answer there?

Any help is welcome to solve the issue, I am stuck for days now, this seems to be really the last issue I am having, I am out of ideas right now.

I am able to compile the FW, so if you want me to change things there to try something I could do that.

kage-chan

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2872
But, I also haven't found the reason sparkybg gave why it should not be connected the other way round, like for the C210. Can anyone point me to a answer there?
It's because C210 TC is connected differently within cartridge.
With C245, temp sensing is using both diff. amp. channels with ch. B going below GND, while calibration is done using ch. A only, probably the problem is with ch. B, i.e. U16 and surroundings. Is -0.6V rail OK?
Having the ability to switch between channels in calibration mode will ease the input section troubleshooting.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2873
. . .
  • I have double an triple checked my wiring. I cannot seem to find a mistake or problem. Just as an additional information, I have no idea if it matters: vout2+ and vout2- were mixed up before, but they should be correct now. Looking from the top on the Molex connector for the iron power: top left: vout1-, bottom left: vout1+, top right: vout2-, bottom right: vout2+. Could anyone please confirm this?
  that's correct for the molex, about mess with Vout2, if you have correct ID and the Fuse 5A wasn't burned still everything  is ok, to be sure check R64 and D21

. . .
  • When in calibration mode and the tip + cartridge are connected,
use 10 Ohm R when measure the input chain ( to have your hardware safe, the time you measure and your hands free ). Read and compare from page 190

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2874
Hi,

thank you  guys for the quick reply.

It's because C210 TC is connected differently within cartridge.
With C245, temp sensing is using both diff. amp. channels with ch. B going below GND, while calibration is done using ch. A only, probably the problem is with ch. B, i.e. U16 and surroundings. Is -0.6V rail OK?
Having the ability to switch between channels in calibration mode will ease the input section troubleshooting.

Thank you for the clarification regarding the C210. I also do suspect channel B being not ok. U16 is more or less brand new. I replaced U16 before. Shortly after that, I realised that I had D21 and C64 shorted (GND pin of D21 to high side of C64). That should have protected the BCH input of U16 from any damags I guess. How can I test if it is ok or not? I do not have a replacement at hand. The -0.6V rail is at -0.67V, I guess that's ok? Is there a way in the supplied FW to calibrate Ch B?

  that's correct for the molex, about mess with Vout2, if you have correct ID and the Fuse 5A wasn't burned still everything  is ok, to be sure check R64 and D21
use 10 Ohm R when measure the input chain ( to have your hardware safe, the time you measure and your hands free ). Read and compare from page 190

D21 and R64 seem to be ok, as written above, there was a short, but it is fixed now. For channel A the values match up. Is there a way to do the same for channel B, without rewriting the FW?

Thanks for the help guys!

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2875
Sorry, what you need to do with B ch. is to be sure that you have good connection to the Iron and to measure 15k for R64
I couldn't understand what parts you don't have

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2876
Hi,

use 10 Ohm R when measure the input chain ( to have your hardware safe, the time you measure and your hands free ). Read and compare from page 190

Can I do that for sense B, without modifying the firmware? Or do I have to modify the firmware for that?

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2877
Can I do that for sense B, without modifying the firmware? Or do I have to modify the firmware for that?
FW modification is required. Theoretically, only SChannel parameter of NO INSTRUMENT profile have to be changed to 2, but I didn't tried it. Both current source channels are set to 128, so calibration resistor can go to either. If you have some problems with ch. B ADC value would be close to its limits.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2878
Well, it works, but I forgot that heater channel also have to be switched for SenseB <> Vout2- calibration. But with SChannel only configured, resistor may be connected to SenseB <> Vout1-. Should show same R 1000 as with ch A.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #2879
Hi,

FW modification is required. Theoretically, only SChannel parameter of NO INSTRUMENT profile have to be changed to 2, but I didn't tried it. Both current source channels are set to 128, so calibration resistor can go to either. If you have some problems with ch. B ADC value would be close to its limits.

Thank you for the SChannel hint, I couldn't find any documentation of that parameter in the source code, it would have taken me a lot longer to figure out. Thanks!

And, senseB seems to be perfectly fine. When I change only the SChannel parameter to 2 and connect the 10 Ohm resistor between vout1- and senseB I get ADC values of around 999-1002 (exactly the same as with senseA). When I additionally change the heater channel to 1 and connect the resistor between vout2- and senseB I get 993-995. So an acceptable deviation.
But, that in my eyes also shows, that the wiring is definitely ok, right?

Any other ideas what might be wrong?

I just noticed that my EARTH wire is not connected anywhere yet, it's floating. Wanted to connect it to PE later, when the PCBs are in an enclosure. I'm powering the PCBs with a DC lab supply at around 15 V. Might that be an issue? Just wondering...