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Topic: Really universal soldering controller (Read 1047164 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #120 –
[quote author="sparkybg"]
PCBs looks pretty nice.
[/quote]

Yes, I was little worried about drilling accuracy. But that turned out fine. The soldermask is little off but that should not make a problem, because it does not actually cover the pads. It is little strange that vias on front PCB are actually better looking and partially exposed. On the back PCB they are covered with soldermask which creates little bubbles (which is not so pretty). But on the other side of back PCB there are somevias which are similar to vias on front PCB (more on photo.) My personal guess is that it is result of existence of drill drawing and guide in front PCB gerber files (as this is seen in all 10 copies of each design, not just one board.) The silkscreen is good I think but I have seen on internet photos with comparable print and comments ranging from not much to horrible. So...[attachment=0]

[quote author="sparkybg"]You can make them in the kitchen oven, if you have stencils. :) However, I made them purely with soldering iron. No hot air whatsoever. Just get yourself a decent flux. I am using BGA no-clean flux.
[/quote]

I was thinking of somethink similar as I have old oven in kitchen I am going to renovate soon. I would still need to mock up some form of controller as to not heat it more that the 260°C limit electronics parts seem to have. I have this paste and if I am reading the profile correctly it approaches this limit point.

I am not sure my hand would be still enough not to scrape IC packages with hot iron. BTW I am using KINGBO RMA-218 from China (Aliexpress) and hard rosin dissolved in alcohol with glycerine for SMT work and so far it worked quite well combined with Stannol HF32 S-Sn60Pb39Cu1 0.32mm wire. But I have not yet made too much. Truth is I have been little leery about investing 30 EUROs into brand flux from reliable supplier.

[quote author="sparkybg"]You can use 0.003 and 0.004 ohms. On the schematics there's a table what the resistor values of the amplifier are for 0.003 and 0.004 shunt.[/quote]

Ah, of course. I was little confused as on the back schematics these is hard-coded value of 0.003.

[quote author="sparkybg"][quote author="Erythros"]
The 60V in TVS is reverse standoff voltage?
[/quote]
Yes.[/quote]
Ok, after this I have found that the note Tranzorb actually means name of product line from VISHAY.

[quote author="sparkybg"]If the pad layout and the voltages are the same, you can use another controller, but you will also have to modify the firmware to support it. The commands and the initialization of every OLED controller chip is different. So if you ask me - get a SSD1306 OLED.[/quote]
That's given. Looking how it is solved in u8glib pretty much proved that it is just shifted. The SH1106 has matrix 132x64 so they just place the 128x64 in the middle so it is shifted by two points from left and right. And playing with it I can see two points width bar on right side when driving as SSD1306. But it will be surest to gen panel with SSD1306. I just seems so tiny, even the 1.3 inch version. But then the bigger ones (2.4) are expensive: about 20 USD per panel - that seems little excessive for soldering station (like the colour LCD on newer JBCs).

BTW, is there some hidden design factor for use of IPD053N08N3 or should similar N channel MOSFET with similarly low Rds(on) and values of Id, Vds, Vgs and Pd also fit the bill?

[quote author="Circuiteromalaguito"]Can a 7seg and OLED displays be used at same time? Is the firmware ready for that?

The idea is to use a big 7seg display for temperature and maybe other important stuff (change iron? Sleep mode? OFF?) because of greater visibility.[/quote]

I don't think I get the idea behind this. The OLED has very nice viewing angles. And it is just soldering station - there is not much information you would need displayed.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #121 –
[quote author="Erythros"]
BTW, is there some hidden design factor for use of IPD053N08N3 or should similar N channel MOSFET with similarly low Rds(on) and values of Id, Vds, Vgs and Pd also fit the bill?
[/quote]
The important parameters are package, Rds(on), Vds, and gate threshold voltage. Nothing more.

[quote author="Erythros"]
I don't think I get the idea behind this. The OLED has very nice viewing angles. And it is just soldering station - there is not much information you would need displayed.[/quote]
You need nothing more than temperature, but no one will refuse the power bar and indication, instrument indication, error explanation, and parameter menu. I just decided to try it out. Both the size and price for 3pcs 7 segment indicators + driving IC is comparable to an 0.96 OLED + boost chip behind it. And once you get used to it, the 7 segment version looks awful.

The same is with color display - if it is cheap enough for a company like JBC, why not put it in there. There are MCU-s with internal TFT controller on the market. And 3.5inch TFT is definitely cheap enough. It starts around $10 on ebay, which means it is even cheaper for a company. If I ever make another revision of the controller, I will put a 3.5 inch TFT+ touch screen in it. You have $10 display, $10 MCU controlling the whole thing, and no mechanical switches whatsoever. When you add to this the panel of the box, which will be considerably simpler to manufacture and with less parts, you may end up with a cheaper solution using a color TFT instead of 7 segment or OLED + switches/encoders.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #123 –
Everything other than resistive heater cannot be controlled and is impossible to add.

Moreover, It is impossible to make universal controller for frequency specific devices.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #124 –
So I had the stencils cut on laser and it didn't turn out so well. It is usable but there are some quite big problems. It was tried with 0.1 mm transparency (for laser printers) and 0.2 mm one for general office use. The main probles is with size – as I made the drawing from soldermask gerber I didn't resize it to small enough size. Also given how my gerber viewer exported the layer to SVG and DXF, most pads were polygons with circles in corners, when shrinking it created even more complex forms. Which sadly turned out to be problematic. Mainly on the power back board – stencil for this turned out to be pretty unusable. There are starting holes outside of rectangle (as seen  in photo). But I also tried to lasercut stencil for another board I am planning to build – one with special gerber file for stencil with true rectangles and that turned out fine so I am hopeful that with more time customizing my drawing (mainly making polynoms into rectangles) in AutoCAD I will be able to get good results. Definitely will try again.

[attachment=0]
[attachment=1]

I also ordered parts. Of cource some weren't in stock and some items weren't even in catalogue so will still probably need to order from Farnell (well, local distributor when in vicinity to save on postage). Not sure if I will get the parts currently not in stock as this is TME and they are quite arrogant about fulfilling orders, but I got the bulk today.

I made some observations about BOM:

The FZT605 darlington array is SOT223 but the footprint on board looks like it could also accomodate DPAK. (Also in the illustration it looks like DPAK.) Quite interesting (at least for me), any reason for it? I was planning to use NZT605 from Fairchild but maybe something in DPAK would be better.

What are you using as the J5 RJ11v header (in BOM as 8 pin, actually just 6 pin with holding holes)? I found header which could fit in TE Connectivity catalogue. Not sure if I will use it or do it some other way.

By measuring I concluded that I can solder diodes in miniMELF package onto pads for SOD123 (which use diodes specified in BOM). The illustration also shows miniMELF. And it is much sipler to buy diode in miniMelf that SOD123.

Still I will have to study datasheets of most of the diodes or buy them from Farnell. But I don't think  that they are so specific as to be problematic to substitude.

In BOM there is pot BOURNS 3362. I think that 3362 is leaded version and the pads on PCB are for SMD. I ordered 3364X and it fits.

For anybody ordering diodes for rectification, I could't find SR580 anywhere alse than Comet. So it it just diode I ordered some other model. Only it is P600 package and there in not enough room for it to put flan on PCB. The TVS is also P600 so I will put 3 diodes on PCB and 2 on them creating pyramide. Will look interesting.

Don't know if I am just looking in wrong slaces but the SMD 0805 27kohm 0.1% resistor seems pretty hard to find. Only Farnell seems to have them. TME stocks only 27.4kohm.

Looking at L1 maybe the reason for the so much covered vias on back board (about which I was complaining in my previous post) is that some chinese worker actually thought about it. The pads on the coil are huge and expand beyond the pads on PCB, so if the vias on PCB were even little uncovered there would be chance for short. Very interenting.

[quote author="sparkybg"]
The same is with color display - if it is cheap enough for a company like JBC, why not put it in there. There are MCU-s with internal TFT controller on the market. And 3.5inch TFT is definitely cheap enough. It starts around $10 on ebay, which means it is even cheaper for a company. If I ever make another revision of the controller, I will put a 3.5 inch TFT+ touch screen in it. You have $10 display, $10 MCU controlling the whole thing, and no mechanical switches whatsoever. When you add to this the panel of the box, which will be considerably simpler to manufacture and with less parts, you may end up with a cheaper solution using a color TFT instead of 7 segment or OLED + switches/encoders.[/quote]

You are probably right. The price difference is small. But still and maybe because of this I think that it is marketing move. JBC uses it on higher models. (Not the single handle version one.) Metcal (or Thermaltronics) is using simple 1602 display and it is enought. But then they have the 13.56MHz curie point heating technology as selling article. JBC is in the resistive heating pond which is so far lot more competitive with chinese manufacturers so it needs to separate itself better and the color LCD probably produces nice enge.

I am little leery of touch interface on soldering station. I can see myself trying to change temperature or other settings while holding soldering pen as cigarette with fingerpads dancing on touchscreen. And that is good way how to stab the touchscreen with hot iron and I am not sure cheap screen from China most people like me will be able to get theirs chubby finger on will be able to withstand it.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #125 –
[quote author="Erythros"]
The FZT605 darlington array is SOT223 but the footprint on board looks like it could also accomodate DPAK. (Also in the illustration it looks like DPAK.) Quite interesting (at least for me), any reason for it? I was planning to use NZT605 from Fairchild but maybe something in DPAK would be better.
[/quote]
The footprint is compatible both with DPAK and SOT223.

[quote author="Erythros"]
What are you using as the J5 RJ11v header (in BOM as 8 pin, actually just 6 pin with holding holes)? I found header which could fit in TE Connectivity catalogue. Not sure if I will use it or do it some other way.
[/quote]
The connector is 6 pin. It is used for sensor in the stand. 2 additional connections on the schematic are for 2 big holding holes.

[quote author="Erythros"]
By measuring I concluded that I can solder diodes in miniMELF package onto pads for SOD123 (which use diodes specified in BOM). The illustration also shows miniMELF. And it is much sipler to buy diode in miniMelf that SOD123.
[/quote]
Again, the footprint is compatible with both footprints. I think miniMELF is harder for machine soldering, so I made it compatible with both.

[quote author="Erythros"]
Still I will have to study datasheets of most of the diodes or buy them from Farnell. But I don't think  that they are so specific as to be problematic to substitude.
[/quote]
Some of the diodes are critical, specificaly these in sot23 package. They should be with small enough reverse current. They should not be Schottky, LL4148 are OK, for example, but these are made from various manufacturers with pretty different reverse currents, so I decided to use other diodes with similar ratings.

[quote author="Erythros"]
In BOM there is pot BOURNS 3362. I think that 3362 is leaded version and the pads on PCB are for SMD. I ordered 3364X and it fits.
[/quote]
It was 3362 some time ago, the I changed it. I will correct this in the BOM and schematics. The PCBs should be OK. The new part is SMD, as you already mentioned.

[quote author="Erythros"]
For anybody ordering diodes for rectification, I could't find SR580 anywhere alse than Comet. So it it just diode I ordered some other model.
[/quote]
SR580 means "Schottky rectifier, 5A, 80V". There's nothing special about these diodes. Just use 5A 80V Schottky.

[quote author="Erythros"]
 Only it is P600 package and there in not enough room for it to put flan on PCB. The TVS is also P600 so I will put 3 diodes on PCB and 2 on them creating pyramide. Will look interesting.
[/quote]
Do not solder them close to the PCB. Solder 2 of them 1mm from the PCB, and another two 5-6mm from the PCB. The cooling is much better this way.

[quote author="Erythros"]
Don't know if I am just looking in wrong slaces but the SMD 0805 27kohm 0.1% resistor seems pretty hard to find. Only Farnell seems to have them. TME stocks only 27.4kohm.
[/quote]
As I said, I am buying parts from Farnell. Mouser for example also has them in stock. There are some areas TME doesn't have good stock in. Maybe Digikay also has them. You can buy 100pcs of 1% 27K resistors and maybe you will find around 10pcs 0.1% in them. You will have to measure them with good enough resistance meter of course.

Looking at L1 maybe the reason for the so much covered vias on back board (about which I was complaining in my previous post) is that some chinese worker actually thought about it. The pads on the coil are huge and expand beyond the pads on PCB, so if the vias on PCB were even little uncovered there would be chance for short. Very interenting.

[quote author="Erythros"]
Metcal (or Thermaltronics) is using simple 1602 display and it is enought.[/quote]
Metcal does not need display at all. There is nothing to display on it. :) The power supply of their stations just provides the needed HF power to the tip and nothing more. My the way, it is with pretty poor efficiency, maybe around 10-20%. Thet's why it is so big.

[quote author="Erythros"]
I am little leery of touch interface on soldering station. I can see myself trying to change temperature or other settings while holding soldering pen as cigarette with fingerpads dancing on touchscreen. And that is good way how to stab the touchscreen with hot iron and I am not sure cheap screen from China most people like me will be able to get theirs chubby finger on will be able to withstand it.[/quote]
Well you are working this way, and I am not. :) Again - everyone has his own opinions when making decisions how to work with his station, and what station to work with. Touchscreen is only one of the possibilities, pretty easy to manufacture. I am far from thinking it will suit everyone's behavior.

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #126 –
Hi sparkybg,

I would like to ask you if there is a date for providing assembled (or spare) PCB's of your great universal soldering controller ?

Thank you for any update....

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #127 –
Erythros - 6pin RJ connector is RJ12

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #128 –
[quote author="sparkybg"]

If the pad layout and the voltages are the same, you can use another controller, but you will also have to modify the firmware to support it. The commands and the initialization of every OLED controller chip is different. So if you ask me - get a SSD1306 OLED.[/quote]

For all OLEDs (0.96 ", 1.3") applies, the offset is derived
on size, not on the wiring:
SSD1306 -> 0.96"-> H-Offset = 0
SH1106 ->  1.3" -> H-Offset = 2

Re: Really universal soldering controller

Reply #129 –
[quote author="giovannirat"]Hi sparkybg,

I would like to ask you if there is a date for providing assembled (or spare) PCB's of your great universal soldering controller ?

Thank you for any update....[/quote]

I don't know yet. Sorry.

Re:

Reply #131 –
[quote author="Circuiteromalaguito"]
Hakko FX-888D does not use it. Why?
[/quote]

Some people are driving BMW, other Mercedes. Why?

Re: Re: Re:

Reply #132 –
[quote author="sparkybg"][quote author="Circuiteromalaguito"]
Hakko FX-888D does not use it. Why?
[/quote]

Some people are driving BMW, other Mercedes. Why?[/quote]


I have no idea of cars, I don't like to drive and even lack a driver's license. But I suppose you mean it's related to saving costs. Am I right?

Do you know other soldering stations using toroidal transformers?

Re: Re: Re:

Reply #133 –
[quote author="Circuiteromalaguito"]
Do you know other soldering stations using toroidal transformers?[/quote]

Why should I care what others are using? The controller works with any decent transformer, toroidal or not.

Re: Re: Re: Re:

Reply #134 –
[quote author="sparkybg"][quote author="Circuiteromalaguito"]
Do you know other soldering stations using toroidal transformers?[/quote]

Why should I care what others are using? The controller works with any decent transformer, toroidal or not.[/quote]


 Okay. I just wanted to know if others use it. I just was curious about it and the possible reasons behind it.

I'm sorry a lot if I annoyed you!