Dangerous Prototypes

We really liked Arhi's SID gen 3...so we decided to build our own. We allready build a Version 1 which was based on his gen2 but a few bugs were found out, and corrected. so now here is the Soldering Iron Driver V1.5. Its based on arhis Gen3.
Read about his project, and development here...
viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457 (http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457)
Read about our version here:
http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Pat ... evelopment (http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Patrick:_Soldering_iron_driver_v1_development)

This driver is capable of driving all soldering irons based on RTC, J or K type thermocouples...ITs been tested on Hakko, Gordak, Solomon, and Weller soldering irons....

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PERFETTO !!!!

Lemme know when PCB's (or even a full kit) will be available as I know some ppl that would like to purchase it :)

WOW, great board, pity that it's not single sided :)

Just found a perfect encoder for the controller COPAL RECW20D50-201-1 (optical beast)

[quote author="ZASto"]WOW, great board, pity that it's not single sided :)[/quote]

Well, if it was single sided it could not have nice ground under the analog input... also you can always make 2 sided board at home and solder parts on both sides :D, not that you never did it :D

[quote author="ZASto"]Just found a perfect encoder for the controller COPAL RECW20D50-201-1 (optical beast)[/quote]

The major issue I had with encoders is the freaking button. I have some encoders with buttons at home and the "softest" one requires 0.7 kg of force to press the darn button ... (the other ones require more then 1 kg) ..

Nah, will wait for PCB's :)
You know that I'll take one, don't you :D

As for encoder button, mine is without, will figure out some good layout for the box (hint: 5MK) :)

I already have the 5MK box for it :D, assembling it right now :D

It uses more I/O pins but how about these kind of buttons for controlling? the force is comparable (a little bit more then) to a normal switch.

http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/alps-s ... th=156_160 (http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/alps-skqu-4-direction-joystick-w-switch-p-161.html?cPath=156_160) or http://www.voti.nl/winkel/catalog.html?SW-JS-02 (http://www.voti.nl/winkel/catalog.html?SW-JS-02)

I never used joysticks on my electronics, I was tempted few times... anyhow for soldering iron I think encoder is way better choice as 99% of the time you will be only rotating it, the button is used only if you go trough menus (calibration, startup options etc..) so it's not crucial...

there are lots of IOs available, and many different interfaces could be made....2/6 broken out pins are interrupt driven, 3/6 are analog/digital... and 1is digital only...

Just put the encoder remote from the board, in the top so you can mash it (with a hammer if needed!)

[quote author="AndThen"]Just put the encoder remote from the board, in the top so you can mash it (with a hammer if needed!)[/quote]

somebody else uses my trouble shooting method too.

I happen to found this jog dial at mousers:

http://nl.mouser.com/ProductDetail/CK-C ... BLOhtYg%3d (http://nl.mouser.com/ProductDetail/CK-Components/TSW-A-3N-C-LFS/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMsFLoxuNbFfpd6dlm214rrePDT9BLOhtYg%3d)

the force is rated at 200g. It looks kinda the dial on the backside of some higer end Canon DSLRs.

Hi guys, I got a free pcb of the version 1 and I want to know what part is R32, is a NTC?

jup its the ntc...although I would advise you to wait a while before building anything as there is no firmware that suports the board, jet, if you are familiar with writing your own firmware, you could extrapolate from arhis gen3 driver, only watch out as he uses a different pinout...

there are also errors on this board you should be avare, it does not support RTD type irons, hakko/gorak...etc. it only supports k-type sensor stuf...also firmware for it most probably wont be built. the reason for this is that we rushed these prototype boards before arhi figured out there were issues with his gen2(on which this was based) in the mean time Arhi updated his to  gen3, and we did as well,our V1.5 corresponds with arhis Gen 3....sorry for the inconvenience..

If you need any help figuring stuff out, and continue to build the board, I am here to answer any questions...

I could try to write my own firmware, I read that arhi posted a little hack to support Hakko-like soldering irons on the gen 2. However i have to wait because i don't have all the components yet.
Can you tell me the value of the NTC?

Thanks.

Any NTC will work. You just need to make a proper lookup table in your firmware for the R32/R33 voltage divider. For 100-200k NTC a 10k is good choice for voltage divider. If you go with smaller value NTC like 2k then you want to use 4k7 for the voltage divider... Then you need to implement in firmware the NTC you used, every NTC is "special" so you need table for specific NTC you use. You can check out the GEN3 firmware and adapt it (probably just fixing the hardware.h might get you running). There you will find a table for 204GT NTC.

BTW, I jsut soldered up my own V1. well the power supply that is...and it works without problems, I'll solder up the analog section tomorrow and tell you my results...This is the first time this board has been soldered...so anything can happen :)

great, thanks

did some preliminary tests with the analog section, I think my mcp617 died before I put it into the board, because there was a constant 3V output, when there should have been noe, I replaced it with a lm358...and now the funny stuff happened, it did measure the k-type TC as it should...but I think I might have soldered a wrong resistor somewhere because the amplification was way off....the range was 50mV when no heat is applied to the TC, and 0.5 when a soldering iron i brought into contact with the TC...

I'll continue to debug it...the major this is I have no mcp617 locally, and for them to arrive is gonna be a long wait....

that preliminary test you made with old DP board?

yup...I mussed have gotten my resistors wrong, I'll check up on it today...

The jp1 jumper, what is for?

when you have to get a triac and a triac optocoupler, which parameters do you have to look?.I have a bta06sw triac, and a IL410 but i don't are sure that they can work together.

I am wandering, is there any chance to use some other, cheaper, pin-compatible pic for example without USB stack build-in? I don`t like the idea to connect this station to my PC without any isolation.
Great project and congratulations!

p.s. sorry for my english

You don't have to use the USB, it is only there for upgrades and debugging for developers.

I think there are other PICs with the same pinout, but note that we use a lot of peripherals so it will need to exactly match ADC and PWM locations. Also, you will of course need to recompile the firmware to work with the new PIC.

18f2550 can be replaced with a 16f876a for example (I believe that you can use any 28 pin pic, not sure) but do you have to rewrite the firmware.

if the isolation is the only problem, just put the 18F2550 in and don't use the usb. Mine firmware don't use USB at all and I didn't even populate the USB connector on my boards... 18F2550 is pretty cheap and you will really have hard time finding a good replacement for it that's cheaper. Just use the 18F2550 and ignore the usb connector

Also, 16F has half the flash 18F has so you'd really have to optimize your firmware and remove all fancy menus (calibration etc) .. it's not worth it for the difference of few bucks if even that much

A good idea would be to use IC sockets, that way you can have the pic18f2550 and when you get tired of the SID there are a gazilion projects online for them.... you can reuse it...

Arhi argumentation conviced me. I was thinking about designig my own version of the SID by I will build your version beacouse it is well tested an I see that you put a lot of work in this design. Great work once again!

keeping a spare 18f2550 programmed with pickit2 firmware is good idea if you blow up your programmer.

2550 is so versatile that every time I purchase them I always order 20 or more :D ... it used to be my #1 choice for 28pin dip mcu for years ... as if you want 5V mcu in 28 pin package 18f2550 is most bang for the buck. There are few other 5V devices in that case but all are very poor wrt hw inside and wrt amount of flash they have ... There are some "better" device in 16bit (and now 32bit too) segment of mchip but they are all 3V only (I might have missed some but..) .. and of course, there's always 18F2553 (Arakis reminded me of that one few days ago) that's identical as 2550 but with 12bit ADC :)

arakis, how did go with the pcb?

Guillermo, I suggest you don't waste time with DP v1.0 as you should have already received the 3.1.4 version of mine board that is tested, works with both HAKKO and Weller, Solomon and has firmware that works. DP v1.0 is not tested, is known to have few bugs and there's no firmware for it.... So why waste time with it when you have the pcb that works (I assume it arrived to Italy by now since the post office said it will definitely left the country on January 9th the latest)?

DP version 1.5 is compatible with mine 3.1.4 (schematic is identical) so the firmware also works 1/1 and is also tested and works... (kudos to Filip for making a 100% trough hole version on 8x8cm board with separated grounds and all in all GREAT PCB design, I like the DP 1.5 version way more then mine 3.1.4)

arhi, thanks for send me the board. Until now, nothing, probably will arrive next week.
Thanks a lot.

well as I mentioned we celebrate Xmas (and NY) on Julian calendar (since Serbian orthodox church never accepted Gregorian calendar) so the January, especially first half, is pretty hectic here.. 3 boards went to usa, I know one already arrived, dunno about other two....

I have some 18f2620 from a previous project. It looks like are pin compatible with 18f2550, I guess I should be able to use them as replacement. Maybe the firmware should be recompiled.

Firmware will most definitely have to be recompiled, and probably several configuration fuses changed to match the new chip.

Soldering home made PCB seems to be pretty hard with current (v1.5) layout.

Yes, the new layout is not really single-sided or homemade board friendly. The added complexity was enough that we needed to use a 2-layer PCB.

there was just no way to fit everything on a 8x8 board and keep it single sided, I mean it could have been done, the ground pour would have required lots of jumpers...and it would have looked real ugly....also we wouldn't have been able to add grounds below components or separate them as we did in V1.5.

Making 2-sided board is not so hard. Soldering elements, especially  IC`s on the top side is quite tricky. I appreciate the amount of work and effords putted to design this board.

Guy's I'm sure these boards will be in PCB DRAWER in few days, why would you bother to etch them at home :D when you can get them from DP professionally made :D

[quote author="Loki"]Making 2-sided board is not so hard. Soldering elements, especially  IC`s on the top side is quite tricky. I appreciate the amount of work and effords putted to design this board.[/quote]

If you are building them at home keep in mind that the clearances were not optimized for home etching,  I thing 10/10mil is the DRC I used... Also you can solder on anything on the top layer by using solder-paste, and a hot-air, but doing it with a soldering iron I just don see it happening, especially CAPs, inductor, or the large SCREW headers

Hi,
Very interesting project.
Any news when finished PCBs will be on stock ?

Regards,
Dino

They have not arrived yet, but I assume they shipped. I would guess in the next few weeks.

I knew theres a reason to keep an weller station, this is perfect
Eagerly awaiting the pcbs also

My PCB from Arhi finally arrived today :D almost 4 months later (Serbia you silly place :D) I cannot wait to build this up. Already placed another digikey order.

thanks Arhi

Im wondering; what is the minimal configuration? Like can I skip the DCDC circuit if I power it direct from a DC 24v? I noticed on Arhi's pics there was alot of little segments of the schematic un-populated. I would like (for now atleast to get it working) to keep it as minimal as possible then build on that.

Any suggestions?

YAY! Read this (again) for starters
viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457&start=360#p35137 (http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457&start=360#p35137)
and this one
viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457&start=360#p35531 (http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457&start=360#p35531)
Probably this one too, and it's link also. firmware is 2 posts below this one.
viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457&start=330#p34700 (http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457&start=330#p34700)
I'll call this one the "assembly photo", and quit linking the other thread now
viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457&start=330#p34847 (http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457&start=330#p34847)

Good luck!

That first link said the DC wasnt tested; but on the 'assembly photo' it is populated. So I can skip that part using a 25v wall adapter right? Do i need to jumper anything or can I simply plug it into the power connectors? (the schematic noted which one for - and +). Or was he talking the DC FET area?

The populated DCDC is for the board, yup. And the drivers are FET and TRIAC areas, yep.
You'll need to plug 5v in also of course, 25v DC only gets you past the transformer requirement.

you need DCDC any way you go around it, as you need 5V for the pic and op-amp and lcd.
you do not need the usb part (connector, diode)
you need to populate only one output driver, either DC or AC (optocoupler+fet or optotriac+triac). The DC output driver was not tested by me, but many tests with driving regular irons (weller pes51, hakko 907, solomon hq30...) with DC destroyed the heater in under a month!!! so I really suggest you stay with AC

[quote author="arhi"] with DC destroyed the heater in under a month!!! so I really suggest you stay with AC[/quote]
Why does 24V DC destroy the heater while 24V AC doesn't?

[quote author="skint69"][quote author="arhi"] with DC destroyed the heater in under a month!!! so I really suggest you stay with AC[/quote]
Why does 24V DC destroy the heater while 24V AC doesn't?[/quote]


I have zero idea why, but it happens. Someone on blog posted a comment on dp wrt this mentioning some electron migration... All I can say, from experience of few ppl running these AC handles on DC, is that - they die (usually break towards the sensor or towards the ground, less frequently - the heater itself breaks)

yes, is because electromigration.

Hi,
How / where can i order Soldering Iron Driver v1.5 PCB ?
Sorry new in forum

Dino

Its not for sale... Atleast not at this point. Its still a prototype; you have to win a FREE PCB code and get a PCB free (if there in stock). I don't know if Ian will decide to start selling the Iron driver or not.

@Ian; can you chime in? I would like to know as well. And if you are; can you estimate the price? Or better yet; the when?

I'd like to ask another question, I sent bunch of the pcb's out (one came back :( ) ... Ian made the v1.5 and afaik also sent bunch of pcb's out .. did anyone assemble it? did anyone tested it? tried it out? or are me and arakis only one trying it out?

Hehe, I tested Arhi's g3 it works as advertised :), Didn't get the V1.5 boards yet, and never got around to test the V1. :)

As far as sales, the V1 and V1.5 will never be sold as assembled kits. We might sell PCBs in the future but that is still to be decided, and no-one that I know of has built 1.5s yet, so we don't even know if they work :), although they should seeing as they are compatible with arhis gen3 boards :)

Arhi, i received your pcb and as you know is working, is actually my official soldering station. I received before yours the DP v1, but i assembled half of it, and i'm using it like a 18f2550 developing board.

post bunch of pictures :D

Re-Post, after posting in wrong topic:

I just ordered the DP v1.5 SID and I've been looking over the Parts List. It's not exactly clear on some things but I did the best I could to find the appropriate parts.

If someone gets a chance could you look this over? I would like to get it nailed down and make it available to others in place of the existing list.

I ended up looking on mouser. I went with 1% for alot of the resistors because they were cheap anyway. For the Headers I just tacked on a strip of 36 SIL for each line item (You can never have too many). I plan to use 2xSIL out of the extras for the DIL. This might be something to change for throwing it out to the masses.

thanks, for making the list, with what part did you have issues?

[quote author="arakis"]thanks, for making the list, with what part did you have issues?[/quote]

A few things, mostly on packages that may have just been specified too far

D1	1	1N4148DO35-7	DO35-7
D2,D3,D4,D5,D6	5	1N4003	DO41-7.6
D8	1	1N5819	DO41-7.6

The 7 and 7.6 part threw me.

IC2	1	LM385Z	TO92

I ended up finding 926-LM336BZ-5.0/NOPB that seemed compatible

L1	1	MICC10	MICC10

I couldn't find an MICC10 but looking through the other blog from Arhi I think I came up with something reasonable 542-78F1R0-RC

Part	Quantity	Value	Package	Qty	Mouser
T1	1	BJT NPN	TO92-CBE	1	512-BC33725BU
T2	1	BJT PNP	TO92-EBC	1	512-KSA733CGBU
TRIAC	1	TIC206D	TO220BV	1	576-Q4004L3
XTAL1	1	20Mhz	HC49U70	1	774-ATS20A

The last ones i think I found something that will work for all of them.

wrt inductor,

for the big one find one that gives you enough current and is higher then 300uH
for the small one (1uH) you can omit it (just put a wire across it to allow current to flow)

[quote author="arhi"]wrt inductor,

for the big one find one that gives you enough current and is higher then 300uH
for the small one (1uH) you can omit it (just put a wire across it to allow current to flow)[/quote]

When you say "gives enough current" do you mean can handle the current? I used the spec'd part from the list for that one.
Is there something I should look for, for maybe needing the 1uH? Will I maybe see some noise or ripple that it would alleviate?

yes, "can handle" enough current. Make sure it is rated for minimum double of what your circuit uses. The standard circuit with regular 16x2 with backlight all together can take up to 300mA so you need min 600mA inductor. If you use low power lcd it can all go down to 30mA and even lower. I for e.g. use 1A 300uH inductor for all devices where I have lcd with backlight.

The 1uH in theory cleans up the noise, but depending on the capacitors you put there it can work against you. I have 1uH only on one device and on all other devices I removed the 1uH and just shorted the leads.

The whole thing is that you have so much inertia in the tip that all the fine twiddling, adding references for fine tuned adc etc etc is waste of time when you have system that lies 10+C without a problem .. so your 50-100mV ripple ain't going to affect nothing in the circuit itself (and if you put all those cap's I placed on schematic, the ripple is almost non existing so that 1uH don't do sh*t)

[quote author="s7726"][quote author="arhi"]wrt inductor,

for the big one find one that gives you enough current and is higher then 300uH
for the small one (1uH) you can omit it (just put a wire across it to allow current to flow)[/quote]

When you say "gives enough current" do you mean can handle the current? I used the spec'd part from the list for that one.
Is there something I should look for, for maybe needing the 1uH? Will I maybe see some noise or ripple that it would alleviate?[/quote]

any inductor ~1uH, with low resistance (less then 0.1ohm) will do, they come in resistor type packages,

but I bought a random 1uH inductor from my local place, and the resistance was so high that the regulator ended up giving 4V instead of 5V.... by shortening it, it works fine, so if you can find a low resistance 1uH inductor you'll have better resolution on your sensor readings, but the PID loop of the sensor heater is so slow on these irons that trying to achieve perfection is not possible. My recommendation is to just short it like arhi mentioned.

*it wont make that much of a difference on the soldering station, and it will still outperform any analog station original station out-there.

Note on C2, C3. The schematic show 0.2uF. The parts list shows the correct 0.1uF part.

caps in the psu are not critical to be the exact values .. you can use 1000uF instead of 470uF or 220n instead of 100n .. will work

@Ian; can you chime in? I would like to know as well. And if you are; can you estimate the price? Or better yet; the when?

Sorry, arakis' estimate is as good as I have too. I am sending it out for a quote today. If it tests and works we will have PCBs for ~10 bucks in a week. I am also giving (public domain) permission to a new startup in china to make kits available, but I will know more after I meet wit them in person next week.

I did also send a bunch out, I bet we see one or two in the next week or so.

Any news ?
My components waiting !!

[quote author="dinoslmn"]Any news ?
My components waiting !![/quote]

sorry no, there are no news, we've been super busy and I don't think anyone at DP has built a SID1.5 yet...I'll go for it over the weekend, although I am unsure I have all the components.

Hello Arakis,
first of all i would like to thank you and Arhi for developing the SID.I have built the SID1.5 two months ago. It still has no enclousure and there are some things to be done, but generally said, it works.

[quote author="turboaleks"]Hello Arakis,
first of all i would like to thank you and Arhi for developing the SID.I have built the SID1.5 two months ago. It still has no enclousure and there are some things to be done, but generally said, it works.[/quote]

we do not trust you, show pictures!!! :D :D :D

debouncing added: viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457&p=40688#p40688 (http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457&p=40688#p40688)

Hello Arhi,

why did i know, that i have to prove it, hehe...
Ok, here is a pic of it. Yes, i am crazy to have soldered it double sided, and it looks strange, but could not wait.
The iron was definetly heating up, but after pluging it this evening, current went down. I will have to check this at the weekend, so little time.

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[quote author="turboaleks"]why did i know, that i have to prove it, hehe...[/quote]

What can I say, I'm a sucker for photographs of electronics :D :D :D

Looks SUPER COOL :D, you etched this yourself? No metalization so you had to solder on both sides .. :)

How are you satisfied with it? Have you tried the latest hext with debouncing?

Yes, i etched it. Your idea and developing impressed me, who wants to buy an expensive station, when there is such a great versatile alternative? I can´t even tell you which hex version (one of the older ones) i flashed, as i wrote, the sid is waiting to be finished for a while now. Next weekend i will try your newest version, looking forward to test it.

[quote author="turboaleks"]Hello Arhi,

why did i know, that i have to prove it, hehe...
Ok, here is a pic of it. Yes, i am crazy to have soldered it double sided, and it looks strange, but could not wait.
The iron was definetly heating up, but after pluging it this evening, current went down. I will have to check this at the weekend, so little time.[/quote]

Awsome build, glad that it worked, sorry for not making it single sided, but I tried that with the DP version1, and it took way too long to develop, also the double sided version has the advantage of better noise suppression with the ground fills, etc...

I moved SVN to SourceForge (http://http://sid.crsndoo.com/)

To get source (mplabx project):

svn co https://arhimed-sid.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/arhimed-sid arhimed-sid 

To get latest "binaries" (pdf's for pcb, hex and cof for mcu): http://sourceforge.net/projects/arhimed-sid/files (http://sourceforge.net/projects/arhimed-sid/files)

Web page is super ugly, and is missing many informations ... if anyone wish to donate better web page - feel free :)

If you think I'm missing something on that page (link to some DP resource..) please send me pm with the info :)

@turboaleks I added your picture to sourceforge "screenshot" list, hope you do not mind

No problem Arhi, it´s your knowledge in the picture anyway, i am only the crazy guy who...
I will post development with your new hex soon.

I went to workshop to get one of the sids to test the new fw, so here's the fixed and tested firmwares:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/arhimed-sid/files/ (https://sourceforge.net/projects/arhimed-sid/files/)

(both for buttons and for encoder)

I took the time to test your new firmware, Arhi. Fixed the problem i had and used the settings for hakko. The soldering temperature is set to 250, no heat pipe is needed for the 206d and all other parts not getting hot. Instead of the MCP619 i took another quad op amp, the LM324 (because i have a few of them). There are no problems using the switches, the encoder is no option for me. The fact, that you provide us the source code, is generous, so HVALA. And indeed, Arakis´ design of the PCB is great. Btw i used the photo-positive-method for it. Making the FT2232 breakout board was a little bit more tricky, but that´s another story...
I still think about using a good sensor for the tip, but it´s not implicitly necessary.

Good to get confirmation that new debouncing code works :D. Filip made a lovely board, I never have that much patience to route stuff that nice, especially with trough hole. Also, I hate soldering trough hole, takes way too much time, smd is way faster (now when I know how to do it properly :D ). Anyhow this was a good time to move the source repository from my internal server to a public one and I managed to import a whole svn into source forge so you can see exactly how the project grew (how I was adding one thing at a time). It gives much better insight into source then the archived final project :D.

As for the lm324, as I mentioned few times, I suck with analog electronics big time. This op-amp was featured in the microchip application note for fixing thermocouple output so I used it. I never spent any time trying to figure out if I can get some other op-amp to work properly with thermocouple too as this one worked and was obtainable. Now for RTD sensor (HAKKO handle) it does not make too much difference as here almost any op-amp will work 'cause you have stable voltage on the input, very slow changes .. no problem at all.. I have no clue if lm324 would work ok for thermocouple but for RTD it works for sure.

as for the sensor in the tip, it works, It's the way I was testing stuff... if you look at the videos
http://youtu.be/bP2fUqB8Jr8 (http://youtu.be/bP2fUqB8Jr8)
http://youtu.be/I78YoVwo3f8 (http://youtu.be/I78YoVwo3f8)
you see that I have a thermocouple embedded in the tip. This gives you incredible control over everything, the problem is, to embed a sensor in the tip itself (I used thermocouple, ntc and ptc) you enocunter 3 huge problems
1. ugly wires that go into the tip, that break off, they bother you constantly
2. you reduce tip quality (the tip is copper core protected with iron shell, when you drill the iron shell the tip will start to corode way faster then normal
3. changing tips becomes huge pain in the butt

It is much better to use a handle that has better positioning of the sensor. If you look at PES51 from weller, you will notice that sensor is positioned "perfectly". The tip "bottom" is a barrel, you push a tip into heater so heater heats outside of the barrel while sensor is deep inside the barrel hence sensor measures tip temperature and not heater temperature. This is the most perfect solution I seen (apart from magnastat) for exchangeable tip station (not counting tip cartage solutions). The only problem with PES-51 is price, while HAKKO handle is $13, PES-51 is ~$50

[quote author="turboaleks"]no heat pipe is needed for the 206d[/quote]

I assume you talk about TIC206 - triac, 400V 4A ?

I'm using some noname triacs myself (600V 26A is written on them - to220 case, red, at least 20y old) and they get slightly warm at start while pushing full power into iron and after that they stay cool even when I solder for hours... so I'd agree that no heatsinking is required there ... I did however on 2 of them attached triac to the alu case just as it was convenient :)

Yes, the triac was ment. I expected more temperature, but ok, better than the other way.
Will have a look at the things you wrote about sensing the tip. Yes, there are some big problems with it.
Somehow i would like to have a precise temperature on the LCD, would be perfect then...

It's impossible to get the precise temp of the tip if you do not have sensor in the tip, but, what I discovered in a year+ working on this problem is that noone really cares about "actual temperature of the tip". The only thing expensive soldering stations care about is that your tip never becomes hotter then your set temp and that's all. The difference between $800 and $40 soldering station wrt tip temperature is that $40 soldering station will use aggressive temp control that will get your tip overshoot the set temp every time it starts the heater while $800 will never overheat your tip. Both will have a 50C drop every time your soldering iron touches the solder joint, and both will actually do the soldering at this lower temperature. You take high end hakko, high end weller, high end pace, high end jbc, high end ersa .. and you drill the tip out, push tc in and test it, and it drops 50C when you start soldering. First I was stunned but then I looked at promo material for these stations, they actually show you that you have this drop, it's "normal", and this drop, they show it to be 30+C for the "ideal" conditions where your solder joint size is identical to your tip size, the tip has the maximum thermal capacity and the solder joint is thermally insulated .. so, I concluded that if all those super expensive stations decided that you don't need better control ...

One thing to add, I tried 3 stations with cartridges (pace, jbc and hakko) and with cartridges you can in theory put sensor in the tip itself and get perfect readout. What I observed was disappointing, they didn't have 50C like regular stations but they had higher temp drop then a cheap PES-51 soldering iron driven with SID

bootloader - done :) viewtopic.php?f=56&t=3269&p=40918#p40918 (http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=3269&p=40918#p40918)

Hi everyone !

I bought a Lukey iron solder arm ,  and as for the mother connector i was thinking of using the ps/2 port from a motherboard .

 My first question would be :  is that ps/2 port from a MB good enough/eligible or should i simply cut the ps2 father connector from the lukey arm and use another type of connectors ?

And if the mother connector ps/2 port from the MB is good , can you please tell how the pins/connections correspondence of it ?

any picture/link of that iron? PS2 should be good enough to survive 2A but I would not bet my life on that ..

http://www.gsmnet.ro/accesorii-si-piese ... ukey--3579 (http://www.gsmnet.ro/accesorii-si-piese-de-schimb-aparatura/brat-letcon-cu-varf-lukey--3579)

(you will able to post url's after few posts, it's a spam protector that works for a day or two or number of messages not sure)

This looks like a hakko clon, but I can't be sure, never seen this one myself. Are you sure it has ps2 connector, I seen ones like this with din5 (like keyboard on old AT/XT)

[quote author="arhi"]gsmnet.ro/accesorii-si-piese-de-schimb-aparatura/brat-letcon-cu-varf-lukey--3579

(you will able to post url's after few posts, it's a spam protector that works for a day or two or number of messages not sure)

This looks like a hakko clon, but I can't be sure, never seen this one myself. Are you sure it has ps2 connector, I seen ones like this with din5 (like keyboard on old AT/XT)[/quote]

From what is says in the description has a ps2 connector , and it connects perfectly with the ps2 port from the mother board .

then it's ps2 .. I'd change that connector as it's really puny .. 2A is not much and it'll probably do but .. it's puny :)

also, make sure it's a hakko clon, figure out how many wires, what they are connected to, what are the resistances etc etc

[quote author="arhi"]then it's ps2 .. I'd change that connector as it's really puny .. 2A is not much and it'll probably do but .. it's puny :)

also, make sure it's a hakko clon, figure out how many wires, what they are connected to, what are the resistances etc etc[/quote]

What type of connecter you would recommend ? what type do you use ?

I made a photo of it http://postimage.org/image/kei20tznp/ (http://postimage.org/image/kei20tznp/) . My friend that recommended the iron say's thats an hakko clone .
I measured the resistance and got these values : http://postimage.org/image/oi0lmbhqh/ (http://postimage.org/image/oi0lmbhqh/)  . the pins are connected -like this  3 with 5 , 1 with 2 and 4 with 6 ! its like the 1-2 and 4-6 pins are shortcircuited :-? .

Does anybody used the ps2 connecter and can please tell me the pin outs :) ?

that on a picture looks lot bigger then ps2, no idea about the pinout, you might wanna open the handle and look how the wires are connected

its ps2 ...

Does anybody know what resistance does the element have ? or the ptc ?

Did anybody used a ps2 connector and knows the pin outs ?

I answer here rather then PM, as the PM system is somehow broken for me and the messages keep getting stuck in the outbox for hours on end....

To get the pin-out I would do the following ...
frst find the ESD pin if there is one :)...simply connect your ohmmeter to the tip of the soldering iron, and check which pin has ~0 ohms to it... that's your tip (or ESD pin)..

now leave that pin out of every other test...

you need two pairs of pins more, the PTC, and the heater element...
as for the heater it should be in the range of ~12ohms....the PTC is a bit more tricky, as each clone seems to have it;s own version ..one is 1.8ohms at 25C while 90 ohms at 400c while others have 10+at 25c and 200+at 400c ...since these values aren;t the best ot go by, you can take your soldering iron appart, it's really simmple, you just uscrew it take the rubber cable holder out of the handle, and youll be left with a little pcb with wireing going into it...from here you can easily pokearound and figure out what's what...

Hi,
Two questions:
1. RV2 value is 100k like on el. scheme or 500k like on Comp. List ?
2. Any real chance to buy a pcb from DP Shop ?
3. If i will decide to make a home pcb can i swap top<--> bottom layers ?
 I can'nt metalize the holes and i have not the ability to soldering between pieces and pcb ( El cond i.e)

Thank
Dino

Hi dino

1. RV2 value is 100k like on el. scheme or 500k like on Comp. List ?

I think it is 100K as shown and approved by arhi here: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=3475 (http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=3475)

2. Any real chance to buy a pcb from DP Shop ?

Next week maybe? I'm getting it out. Not sure why it was delayed other than we are disorganized.

3. If i will decide to make a home pcb can i swap top<--> bottom layers ?

Hey, you said only two questions :) I'm not sure what you mean though. To reflect and rotate both layers? I'm not sure, my spatial reasoning is not that great :)

Thank Ian for answers.
About layers, not rotate only swap between.
Eagle have a script for this. Top will be bottom and vice versa.
Think when you shuffle cards. Pull the bottom card and put it on the top
Not rotate.
I don't now how I can solder the block connector pin if the pad is between block body and PCB. Using a home made PCB without metallised holes.
Waiting for yours PCB !!!

swapping layers would not affect the working of the device (if they are swapped properly) since there's no special pcb design here.. the simple dcdc is used where pcb layout is not that important (except for having fat tracks no other requirements exist), there's no high speed stuff so no worries about that ..

Halleluya!!
PCB can be ordered from Seed
I havent  experience with Speed but i hope shipping will be quick
Dino

[quote author="dinoslmn"]Halleluya!!
PCB can be ordered from Seed
I haven't  experience with Speed but i hope shipping will be quick
Dino[/quote]
2-4 weeks is standard for the cheap shipping method. usually takes them a day or two to actually ship it...

I have built this board, but now i have problems with firmware. I currently have one, where the encoder works, but it's always prompting me to select sensor. I have Hakko 907. Which firmwares do you use? Thank you for help :)

check your connection, if you have hakko 907 and you select it, and it again ask for sensor type it means that it's reading temp that's outside of regular range so it asks again for the sensor .. so either you didn't connect the sensor properly or you didn't go trough calibration procedure and you didnt't calibrate the driver (you have 2 pot's that you need to set to proper values)

calibration:

1. calibrate 1mA trough RTD
instead of sensor, just push your ampermeter in the PTC slots of the board, turn the board on and set CAL1 pot so that you can see 1mA going trough ampermeter.

2. calibrate PTC amplifier gain (to =30)
instead of sensor, attach a 100R 1% (or better) resistor to the PTC connector
remove jumper from JP1
measure voltage on the top pin and turn RV2 until you get 3.00V exactly

Thank you, now it's working. I already did this, but then I was playing with RV2, and apparently that was a mistake.
I have one more question. Always when I power it up, it asks me for the sensor type and I have to set it up every time. Is this normal?

no it is not normal, this is something someone else reported too but I was not able to reproduce that problem... if you have pickit set sensor to hakko and then turn the device off and read the eeprom from 18f2550 and see if values are written to eeprom... I seen report that value is not written to eeprom and in that case sid will always ask you to select sensor. The other reason that it will ask you to select sensor is if it's reading "too cold" or "too hot" when you turn it on.. I'm in middle of the "move to another appt" so I can't check it out but quickest way to solve that is to just change firmware and lock it to HAKKO sensor by default... it's very simple patch I'm sure you will be able to do it :)

possibly a config errror during programing...aka the epprom is locked or something of the sort...  Eisenhorn if you're unsuccessful amending the code yourself, send me the links where and which code you downloaded and I'll check it out...

I'll try to do it by myself, I like programming challenges. I am just not familiar with PIC programming and MPLAB, but I'll do my best to make it work. If not, I'll ask you guys for some help. I am using this firmware (http://http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=2457&start=330#p34746). Thank you for now.

get the firmware from here: http://sid.crsndoo.com/ (http://sid.crsndoo.com/)

I got the pcb's from Seed the other day, (two weeks ago :) )
And was planning to start soldering the parts I have, sockets, resistors and such, but I noticed that the bom looks a bit off:

http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Pat ... evelopment (http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Patrick:_Soldering_iron_driver_v1_development)
For resistors I find this:

R1-R21,R10-R21,R13-R17,R20-R24 = 10k
So, one would think that r1 through r21 are 10k, but why is it listed r10-r21 also?, and r13-r17?
And further down you find:
R4 =220k
R5 =1k
R8 =47
I find similar situation for caps etc.
So either I don't understand anymore how to read an componentlist, or something have gone wrong.
With these Seed pcb's which schema+bom+etc is correct?

schema is same for both but annotation is different so the schema and bom on the link you posted should work. When Arakis return from PRC he might fix it .... afaik they exported that bom from eagle, donno why it messed up like that

So if the schema was available, and I opened up in eagle I would be able to navigate around the board and find correct info?
could not find the schema on that wiki page, but i can still wait, huge amount of components missing still.

original eagle files should be in the SVN ( http://dangerous-prototypes-open-hardwa ... %20Driver/ (http://dangerous-prototypes-open-hardware.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/Soldering%20Iron%20Driver/) ) .. I hoped DP will get their files in order (schematic, bom etc) when they start selling the pcb but looks like they have other plans :(

Thanks!, that was a lot better list.

Hi!. First post in this great place, love to thinkering with electronics although i've never studied properly. Anyway, i've been on the look for a cheap, robust and quality soldering station and i found some places where you can build your own and that's awesome. Then happened to came here and i've to tell you this is great. I hope to begin this project soon. I'll keep an eye here in the meantime.

Thanks and see you around.

[quote author="Dai101"]cheap, robust and quality soldering station [/quote]

hakko fx888

also buying one of hakko clone soldering stations would serve you for a long tine, and the replacement parts are dirt cheap...

if he live in a country (unlike two of us) where he can easily get HAKKO FX888D (replaced hakko fx888) he should get the original and be done with it :) ... if he lives in a shitty country (like the two of us) then all bets are off and clone or a sid or .. will serve him good.

Dai101, if you fill in more details about yourself (for e.g. your location) we can always give better advice, also, SID is a good platform for experimenting and can be a good soldering station but I would not recommend having it as first/only soldering station in da workshop

Well, i'm from Mexico so the shitty country already aswered for itself.

And it's hard to find Hakko parts here, it's a bit odd since here (Guadalajara) has the most electronic manufacture plants in the whole country. You can find other brands (Weller for example) but they are a bit expensive, hell i can buy a soldering station from China and it will cost half the price of a weller, that's why i'm interested in this proyect.

Also, i've a cheap regulated soldering station as my main and 2 AC direct soldering irons, a Weller WP25 and an "El Cheapo" soldering gun.

Thanks again, we'll see around.

Then you are the perfect subject for this project :D
 - you can make and tweak it as much as you like
 - you can change software to change the behavior to your liking
 - you can tweak the pcb to work with almost any soldering pencil that has a sensor (out of the box the PTC type RTD with hakko curve is supported and Thermo Couple but you can easily modify it to work from other type TC sensors, to work with PT100 PTC sensor that's in most wellers, with basically any type of RTD and TC) so only pencils (soldering hands) you can't use are ones with only 2 wires that don't have a sensor but read temperature measuring resistance of the heater

if you wanna give it a go, you can get el cheapo pcb from seeedstudio and start working on it (or you can make pcb yourself as it's not a very hard pcb to make)

Hi. Bumping this thread a little because Xmas came early!!

A guy who knows another guy brougth me 2 soldering iron handles!!! I'll check'em and take pictures of them by tomorrow so you can help me to identify (at least one is a Hakko 907 or a clone) but the other i don't seem to identify.

See ya'll later.

Can anyone explain to me where are R20, R11 and R31 on this picture?
And is this an normal way of marking resistors?

I would think swapping the text R31 and R11 would be better, but is R11 really R11?, or R31?

---

thanks!, that was very nice, easier than reading the BOM, Guess I have to recheck some again :)
(Mostly only soldered the resistors for now)

Seems like Eagle have some good features there.

when entering the size for caps, why is it not used in the same scale?, like, 0.1uF and 100nF is the same cap, or is it different type?
I bought 50v 0.1uF ceramic caps that looked lke the one on the 3D pic, but if using different scale denotes otherwise.. hm

And the two pots for brightness and contrast, what is the size? it's only written B25P and TRIM_EU-B25P, or is it 10R and 150K?, due to the first wrong bom, I have 100R and 50K..
Same with RV2 and CAL, atleast in the new bom it's written 100K and 5K, but I have 500K and 5K.

you know guys, shipping is slow.. thank god there are ebaysellers that have free shipping on these items, so it's only the time that  "costs".. will be interresting when I can try this :)

Can anyone elaborate a bit on the L1 and L2?, They are hard to find it seems, and MICC10 doesnt tell me anything, is that an size?

Btw, U1, MOC0343, I could not find that, but will MOC3041 do?, I couldnt find that it had worser spec? or am I wrong?

[quote author="neslekkim"]0.1uF and 100nF is the same cap, or is it different type?[/quote]

it is same cap 0.1uF == 100nF
difference is just your preference, how you like to write them down :)

And the two pots for brightness and contrast, what is the size? it's only written B25P and TRIM_EU-B25P, or is it 10R and 150K?,

brightness is 1k res not a trimmer iirc, and contrast is anyt trimmer between 2 and 10k, I use 10k but 2k will also work (but your device will use more current)

Same with RV2 and CAL, atleast in the new bom it's written 100K and 5K, but I have 500K and 5K.

RV2 is 500k multiturn, gain of 30 that you need is ~290k so you can use 300k if you have or 100k pot + 220k resistor in series

CAL depends on the reference voltage diode you use, if you use 1.25V reference diode use 2k for CAL, if you use 2.5V reference diode then use 5k for CAL

Can anyone elaborate a bit on the L1 and L2?, They are hard to find it seems, and MICC10 doesnt tell me anything, is that an size?

The inductor that goes between pins 7 and 1 of the lm2574 need to be 330uH or larger, rated for at least 1A
The other inductor  (goes from first inductor to the output) can be just shorted out with a piece of wire but any 1-5uH inductor rated for high current (2-3A) will get the job done, anyhow it's not necesary so if you don't have it, just short it out with piece of wire.

Btw, U1, MOC0343, I could not find that, but will MOC3041 do?, I couldnt find that it had worser spec? or am I wrong?

difference between MOC3041 and MOC3043 is that MOC3041 requires 15mA for the drive led and the MOC3043 requires 5mA. That is the only difference so if you are going with MOC3041 just make sure you use appropriate resistor (it's R32 on my schematic, not sure what is the annot on the dp's schematic but it goes from Vdd to pin1 of the MOC). To get 15mA to properly turn on the MOC3041 you will need to lower this resistor to use 270R (1.3V is Vf of the led inside MOC, 5V is the Vin so 270R will make sure you get 15mA)

all clear?

WOW! :)

on the pcb and schematic the contrast and brightness are variable resistors, singleturn I guess, similar to what is used on the buspirate lcd adapters.
the Moc, I think I have misunderstood the datasheets totally, I thought they could handle more, not required more :)
In the schematics, the resistor between VDD and pin 1 is 1K, so I can replace it with an 270r instead then, or look around to see if I find the correct part

Very good explanations !
Would be cool if it was possible in the schematics to note if some components can be varied, but I guess I should reread all threads and understand the schematics also maybe.
Like all the caps, if they can vary a bit in size, but hey, I'm building up an kinda big partslibrary after all these funny projects :) (on ebay bags of caps are typically 50x and so.. )

[quote author="neslekkim"]
on the pcb and schematic the contrast and brightness are variable resistors, singleturn I guess, similar to what is used on the buspirate lcd adapters.
[/quote]

You do not need multiturm for lcd :D so yes .. and 10k is always safe there.
Contrast you need and it should be 10k (50k as on schematic is also ok)
Brightness pot (just opened schematic) is imo 100% useles (does not exist on my schematic) and you do not need it, just bring Vdd directly to the pin15 of LCD header (short out that pot and don't waste part you will not use)

[quote author="neslekkim"]
the Moc, I think I have misunderstood the datasheets totally, I thought they could handle more, not required more :)
In the schematics, the resistor between VDD and pin 1 is 1K, so I can replace it with an 270r instead then, or look around to see if I find the correct part
[/quote]

it is R19 on DP schematic, just put 270R-330R and it will be ok (I use 280R with MOC3041 as those I have for e.g.)

[quote author="neslekkim"]
Would be cool if it was possible in the schematics to note if some components can be varied, but I guess I should reread all threads and understand the schematics also maybe.
[/quote]

You should read original thread where I wrote as I was designing the thing so you will understand what part does what :D, anyhow, documentation for SID is on DP's WIKI so you can add notes, fix BOM etc etc .. feel free to do it.. I'm not gonna, DP looks like they are just selling and not supporting the thing ... so .. feel free to help yourself with the WIKI and add notes there yourself :D

[quote author="neslekkim"]
Like all the caps, if they can vary a bit in size, but hey, I'm building up an kinda big partslibrary after all these funny projects :) (on ebay bags of caps are typically 50x and so.. )[/quote]

most of the caps can be bigger :)
AC DRIVE:
C17 is in the AC drive part and should be min 50V rated and 10n

PSU:
Diodes (2-6) can be ANY 1A rectifying diodes, 1n4003 is kinda most common but anything you have that can handle 1A will do

D8 has to be a fast Schotky diode, 1n5819 or 1n5820 or similar 1A (or higher) capable Schottky diode (the schematic does not have a proper Schottky symbol there, probably eagle issue)
 
C8 can be any electrolytic cap 470uF or larger rated for min 40V (in theory 36V could work but it's dangerously close to the limit) problem is these get very large physically so it's a question if you can mount them on board (physical spacing), but yes, if you can fit 1000uF 50V it's perfect :D. Note that this one do not need to be low esr high temp blah blah .. just el cheapo elco :)

C9 - this is 47-220nF ceramic rated for over 50V, just to iron high freq's the electrolytic one didn't
I love to mount one 50V 1uF ceramic smd between the legs of C9 but is really not required :D

L2 - this is important inductor, has to be 330uH or larger inductance and minimum 1A rated (it has to be rated minium double the current your electronics is going to draw, pic + lcd + backlight is ~500mA so min 1A rated inductor is required, if you have 1.5A or 2A rated one it will be better and will heat less).

C10,C14 - can be 47-220nF 12V rated
C11,12 - can be 100-1000uF 12V rated

L1 can be a piece of wire of 1-5uH 3A rated inductor

TC sensor path is pretty strict so if you are using thermocouple sensor all parts there should be 1% or better, but if you are not using thermocouple you can leave R5,12,14,15,16,27,34,35  C7,18,19, 20,21 un-populated. If you are, get good quality parts for good precision, especially resistors.

if you are not using NTC input, you can leave R30 unpopulated

If you are not using PTC input you can leave R4,21,23,38,22,24 CAL,RV2, T2, IC2, C4,14,25 unpopulated ... Here the precision of the components is not critical. CAL is used to calibrate exactly 1mA trough your sensor so remove sensor and put your ampermeter between PTC1 and PTC2, tweak CAL to get 1mA through it. As I already wrote use 2k or 5k pot depending on the type of reference you are using (if you use quality mutiturn pot 5k will work for both cases). T2 is any PNP bjt, it's only driving 1mA so really any general purpose PNP will do. Resistor values are 10% tolerance so not too critical 'cause you need to calibrate the gain with R4+RV2. R4+RV2 need to be 290k +- 10k to tweak your gain to 30x so you can use 220k resistor + 100k pot (gives you 220-320k window, more then ok) or you can use 100k resistor + 220k pot or only a 500k pot ... with pot+res you get better resolution so you can get closer to required gain... follow the calibration procedure to get this gain properly out.

I believe this covers all the parts on the schematic ... if you have more questions ..

btw if you are not populating TC or NTC or PTC path, make sure to connect inputs of the corresponding op-amp segments according to the datasheed (+ input tie to ground and - input connect directly to output)

Hi, I'm Italian and it is complicated to follow you ..
I make a question : Using a LM385 "adj" which changes should be made?
I'll have to use a hakko 907 :-)
I finished the PCB and I'm just waiting for the coil. thank's

[quote author="paiano84"]
Using a LM385 "adj" which changes should be made?
[/quote]

should work without change -adj is a 1.25V reference, just use 2k for the CAL

T1 should be NPN that can handle current for your backlight BC337 should fit the footprint and the use case perfectly
T2 should be PNP, since 1mA is going trough it really any one should do. BC327 should fit footprint

I wonder if it is possible to buy one of these boards fully assembled, or i have to source all parts?
Where can I buy the board and parts?
Thanks.

I'm buying piece by piece from ebay, almost finised now, just a couple of strangers missing.
have no clue at all if it will work or not..

@arhi
can i use any these for the triac BTA12-600BRG (http://http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/158168/STMICROELECTRONICS/BTA12-600BRG.html) or BTA12-800BRG (http://http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/158170/STMICROELECTRONICS/BTA12-800BRG.html)

and diodes 1N4003 with (1N4001) / 1N5819 with (1N5817)

is this the correct inductor for L2: 400361378383 (http://http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10-pcs-Magnetic-Core-Inductor-8x10mm-330uH-330-uH-331-1A-DIY-RoHS-New-/400361378383?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5d3765d24f)

thanks

I found the triacs here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/400360728432 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/400360728432)

[quote author="Milton"]@arhi
can i use any these for the triac BTA12-600BRG (http://http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/158168/STMICROELECTRONICS/BTA12-600BRG.html) or BTA12-800BRG (http://http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/158170/STMICROELECTRONICS/BTA12-800BRG.html)
[/quote]

yes, they look ok

[quote author="Milton"]
and diodes 1N4003 with (1N4001) / 1N5819 with (1N5817)
[/quote]

1n4001 is ok, 1n5817 is only 20V and you have 30V on the input so it will not work, you have to go with 1n5819

[quote author="Milton"]
is this the correct inductor for L2: 400361378383 (http://http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10-pcs-Magnetic-Core-Inductor-8x10mm-330uH-330-uH-331-1A-DIY-RoHS-New-/400361378383?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5d3765d24f)
[/quote]

if your electronics is not going to draw more then  500mA then yes it is correct (it's all about what lcd you use, normal lcd with backlight will get you around 400mA, some good ones without backlight will go below 100mA but I have some lcd's that take more then 1A - you need inductor that's going to handle more then double of what you use). It's not expensive so you can try it out :D if it starts to get hot then you have to get one with more current. I use one just like this (1A)

with regards to triacs, I never seen triac that can handle less then 100V and since you are running 24V here, that parameter is not important... also, I never seen triac that can handle less then 2A and you need 2A for this so again it's not a big deal, gate sensitivity is also not too relevant as you are using external driver to drive triac (moc) ... so almost any triac you find will work, you really need to look hard to find one that will not :)

I have newer programmed an pic, what do I need to program it?, can I just use an ftdi cable, or do I need some special programmers?, if I need that, does it exists any cheaper ones that can program various pic chips?

[quote author="neslekkim"]I have newer programmed an pic, what do I need to program it?, can I just use an ftdi cable, or do I need some special programmers?, if I need that, does it exists any cheaper ones that can program various pic chips?[/quote]

you need a programmer (no, ftdi will not do), one of the best and cheapest is called pickit2, you can find pickit2 clone on ebay for under 20$ and it can program many pic chips (almost all of them, it just don't support the latest ones, if you want those too find pickit3 clone but that one is bit more expensive)

so the pickit3 can program the older ones also?, if so, it's only $30
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Clone-Microchip ... 0637699036 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Clone-Microchip-Development-Programmer-Mini-PICKIT-3-/350637699036)
If this one will work then?

there are also these:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/PICKIT-3-Progra ... 0896348126 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/PICKIT-3-Programmer-Debugger-MCU-Universal-ZIF-socket-for-PICkit-2-or-3-/230896348126)

yes pickit3 can program old ones, new ones .. it is also hardware debugger...

the deal with pickit3 is that clones are not that good (for e.g. that one from sure is known to now work in some cases) while pickit2 as way simpler device have no issues with it.

[quote author="arhi"]yes pickit3 can program old ones, new ones .. it is also hardware debugger...

the deal with pickit3 is that clones are not that good (for e.g. that one from sure is known to now work in some cases) while pickit2 as way simpler device have no issues with it.[/quote]
I can vouch for the Olimex pickit3 clone https://www.olimex.com/Products/PIC/Pro ... D2-POCKET/ (https://www.olimex.com/Products/PIC/Programmers/PIC-ICD2-POCKET/) but the price is not that far from the MCP original..

ouch, I ordered this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/350637699036 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/350637699036)
and:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/251140525286 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/251140525286)
so, if that is know not to work, then are there any that are know to work?
checked mouser now, and the orginal seems to cost only €36 for this http://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Micr ... NAcWahhP9A (http://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Microchip-Technology/PG164130/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtqy0n2JbDgYFNAcWahhP9A)

that aint so bad if the clones are dodgy..i guess?

that zif board is perfect and very good build, as for the pk3 clone, I hope sure fixed the problem they had, if you encounter problem you can always ping them and get it sorted out ( http://www.sureelectronics.net/ (http://www.sureelectronics.net/) )

Hi,
I am in final stage. The PCB is full populated ...ok only 99.5%. Waiting for 24k 1% 1/4w resistors
DC-DC works fine.
I have o problem when try to program the PIC
try to load the last .HEX file (for encoder) an the soft show me this error:
>Error in HEX file-FUSE
Line:1223
:0100000024DB
>
Please help.
BTY with same programmer (which support 18F2550) can burn 16F628 w/o problems

Dino

Ok, problem fixed. Used PicKit2 in circuit and imported hex into MPLAB v8.89

what software you use to program?

Hi,
USBPicPrg Re 1.30 , received with the PRG-017 USB PIC Programmer. Installed in WIN 7 and 8
http://www.mcumall.com/USB_PIC_CD.zip (http://www.mcumall.com/USB_PIC_CD.zip)

Thank
Dino

looks like they can't properly read hex ..

Any suggestion ?
From Google .....is a well-known problem
I find a program which can "fix" this but I an not a programmer man and don't know which changes this program make in the hex and if will kip his functionality.


Dino

no clue, I stopped using programmers not made by manufacturer long time ago exactly for this type of problems

[quote author="MickM"]Hi;
  I have that ZIF board.
I had to remove the top cover to use it, you cannot get to the levers.
Also watch out for the pin 1 placement, it is diagonally opposite from the lever.
I marked mine in red.

It works well and is pre-wired for PICS, do not use with AVR's.

Mick M[/quote]
Got these today, but I see you also uses another connector on the adapterboard, is that for something else, or also for the pic's? (no info about it, and the top cover hides it)
But damn, the pickit3 came with an cable that is 6pin in one end, and an rj-11 (or similar) in the other end, and the adapter board did not have any cables, so, out looking for more parts...
What on earth is using rj type plug??

hi
Anyone can give me the debounce autorepeat firmware? i have also this problem, the station works well but every time that restart it displays "SELECT SENSOR CUSTOM".i used a hakko 907.
If i press reset button all is ok,it displays "target 5" and "current 18".what can i do?

one by one guys , don't reply all together ;-)

Dino,
waiting for LM336
I ordered  LM 385, don't remember where I have seen this P/N. Mixed up :-)

BTW ,my Hakko clone or more precisely what I brought from Alliexpres have 41.9ohm and 3.6 ohm measured resistance at room (19-21C) between 1-3 and 4-5 pins. is a PTC ?
RTD ?

@dino, PTC (positive temperature coefficient) is a subset of RTD (Resistance temperature detector)
With regards to resistance at room temperature it's not really too usable info as the curve for PTC's used in hakko and clones are dual values and very non linear below 100C

@paiano84, autorepeat patch has nothing to do with startup failure. The latest firmware from sourceforge should solve the startup issue. Another thing you can do is remove a filter cap in a low pass filter (described in the original thread) as the problem you are experiencing is oscillation in the low pass filter so firmware samples the sensor befor the oscillations stop. The fix is just to add a delay before sampling for the first time and iirc I added that fix to the sourceforge. As for autorepeat code, I did not review it so I did not add it to the svn, I will do that once I find some time.. but you can browse the 2 threads and find the patch and apply it yourself.

Just ordered my parts from mouser, and my brother had a set of boards made.

Can't wait to build it.

Could someone tell me what  component is L1.
there is no cheaper alternative to the MCP619-I/P component, because here in Portugal it costs 7€.

read here: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=3475&start=120#p47229 (http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=3475&start=120#p47229) about all the parts
L1 you don't need to have, you can short it with a piece of wire.

with regards to MCP - what senzor are you going to use? If you are going to use SOLOMON or any other iron with Thermocouple sensor you ahve to go with MCP619 because you need the sensitivity, if you are going to use HAKKO or any other RTD sensor then use any pin compatible operational amplifier, for e.g. MCP6024 or MCP604 or any other single supply rail2rail opamp with same pinout

thanks for the quick response

Who know what is the best PID settings for soldering iron with thermocouple?

Hakko 907 work Ok, but other with thermocouple like weller pes 51; some China ZD irons; Ya Xun  , works with +- 10 C instability.

[quote author="dtmf"]Who know what is the best PID settings for soldering iron with thermocouple?

Hakko 907 work Ok, but other with thermocouple like weller pes 51; some China ZD irons; Ya Xun  , works with +- 10 C instability.[/quote]

are you speaking of PID instability or is the temp sensor reading the wrong temp?
In any case it doesn't realy matter. I was similarly opsesed with tip temperature stability, but then I found out  that the tip temperature drops like 50C during soldering, and even the best soldering iron's in the world take a long time to recover.. IMO +-10c is just fine even for professional soldering environments...

P.S. regarding the PID tuning, there are algoritams on line on how to tune PIDs for heated bodies.. it involves suting two parameters down, tuning the one, then once you got that one the way you want it, you start tuning the second one, and finaly the third.. I believe the order is P then D then I....

+-10c is just fine even for professional soldering environments

Now i know this driver is good only for PTC sensors, and is unfinished. For TK sensors better is Russian free project here (+- 1 C):
http://radiokot.ru/lab/controller/50/ (http://radiokot.ru/lab/controller/50/)

the driver works :) you control heater with great precision and you read precisely your sensor data. that is what driver is supposed to do.

the firmware on the other hand is just example how you can drive it and you can set it up to do whatever you want. The firmware has some basic menus with some basic options and with a simple pid controller (that, like every pid controller need to have P, I and D coefficients set according to the object you are heating). everything about firmware is unfinished - but firmware is open so anyone can work on it, test it, upgrade it, rewrite it .. it was not made to be "ready to use product", it's a platform for learning and testing stuff. if you want ready to use product a hakko fx888d is under 100$ and is perfect soldering iron for hobby projects, you purchase one for under 100$ and you have small compact quality product.. if you don't want quality, for 30-50$ you can get bakku/quick/atten/aoyue/gordak and similar replicas/clones of hakko 936 that works great and are good enough for any hobby shop while costing less then just parts to make this soldering iron driver .. (10$ is just a pcb, another 5$ is lcd, you need min 20$ for transformer and this is already more expensive then working tested gordak 936, not to mention you still need all other parts, mcu, handle, tip..)

I did a simple test:
Op Amp is MCP601 , and scheme for thermocople from this PCB:
http://www.radiokot.ru/forum/download/f ... ?id=142212 (http://www.radiokot.ru/forum/download/file.php?id=142212)
As a result soldering iron with thermocouple works very stable with original PID settings for Hakko(+- 0.2C).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSdn3Wil3LA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSdn3Wil3LA)
Conclusion: Original scheme for thermocouple input is not good.

you did something wrong there then as that schematic for tc amp is actually designed by microchip and works 100%. You see "stable" reading from 601 because mcp601 is showing wrong readings due to burdening the TC. mcp601 has order of magnitude higher quiescent current then mcp617/619 but what makes it a wrong choice for TC amp is the offset voltage of 2mV (or 5 on extended temp range) compared to 150uV on mcp617/619. That is over 30C error

For the beginning  i need stable readings from thermocouple input, and i will continue experiments.

BTW: Hakko FX888 is not universal station, i need something better :)

[quote author="dtmf"]For the beginning  i need stable readings from thermocouple input, and i will continue experiments.[/quote]

you need a reference point to be sure you are reading proper values :) I use industrial grade TC reader but any calibrated thermometer with TC input will work so you can compare data. Also it is important to know if you are compensating or not for the ambient (cold joint). By default firmware is NOT compensating for ambient!!!! The old version was using digital thermometer to check ambient, the latest version can use NTC but you need to turn it on in firmware and you need to enter a resistance table for your NTC.

[quote author="dtmf"]BTW: Hakko FX888 is not universal station, i need something better :)[/quote]

universal .. hm .. donno what is "universal station" :D soldering is a pretty simple task :D and PES51 is hardly more universal then FX888D... in any way this driver is a good testing ground for whatever testing you wanna do and then you can design final product with multiple drivers, different types in the same time, blower, sucker etc etc ..

In the output signal (thermocouple) with mcp619 has interference 1v , when PID is running. I think this  is the problem.

[quote author="dtmf"]In the output signal (thermocouple) with mcp619 has interference 1v , when PID is running. I think this  is the problem.[/quote]

There is something seriously wrong there then!!!
I do not have that on my board. I have not tested the pcb Filip made (one sold by seeed) but if you look at schematic the input from TC goes directly into 619 (trough 10k resistors and over 10n caps), goes trough 2 stage amp and from op goes directly into mcu's adc port. There's no reason for any noise to be generated there ... unless ... hm .. do you have some thermocouple? just a blank sensor? can you attach some external sensor to KTC1-KTC2 instead of sensor on the iron and look at the signal on KOUT (pin7 of the mcp619) while PID is running (touch the tip of the iron with that sensor so that pid has something to control). If the interference is still there then I'd say you or Filip did something wrong but if the interference is gone then the problem is that some current is inducted in sensor wires while operating heater in the soldering iron you have. I did not play a lot with PES51, I did test some other TC setups and it was smooth as baby's butt but it's possible that PES51 design is different. In that case a small patch for the firmware will fix the problem (measure temperature only when heater is not running). I can make that patch during weekend (too much work these days) if you want to test it. (I do have pes51 here but I just don't have time)

Whaaa, where are you reading 1v? with the PES51, I was getting a short between the thermocouple and heater, but I thought it was a blown heater, IT could be a design thing, i guess. Sorry for being a guinea pig.  I still can't get my SiD to work, as programing the 2550 seems to be impossible for my pickit3... I'll get a replacement chip next week and try it out..

Hi,
Need yours help.
Can i use LM336Z-5 (5V) ? and which components need to change, if
First i bring from E-Bay a wrong part (LM335), second i ordered LM336Z-2.5V and i received for 5V.
cant wait again another month....

I'm not sure how will the 5V reference behave with 5V supply but you can try, use a larger pot for CAL, for e.g use 10k and see if you can find a position where you can reliably have 1mA trough the RTD. So attach your ampermeter instead of RTD and turn the CAL pot till you get exactly 1mA. It might work but I never tried.

R21, R22, R23, CAL, ic2, t2 -> the whole point here is to have this 1mA constant current drive and then you read with opamp the voltage on the rtd and by reading that voltage you measure resistance. You can make constant 1mA current source using different parts, for me this was the simplest as I had parts in my drawer

Test with soldering iron YA XUN ( Hakko clone with K type thermocouple)

Capacitor 47 uf in + input remove interference (only 40 mV when PID is running). PID is the same : 3.5 ; 1.875 ; 3.250 . Result is +- 0.5C stability.

---

well that 47uF is not just clearing up noise but is acting as a low pass filter also, there's something seriously wrong with that sensor if it requires that big cap on the input.

with changing 24k to 16k you are changing the gain so you have lower gain hence you don't get temp by just dividing adc value by two - or that is maybe not the same type of thermocouple at all ..

And not too bad PID settings for weller pes 51:
P=4
I=0.1
D=0.4

stability is super :)

with that 47uF on the input?

[quote author="arakis"] I was getting a short between the thermocouple and heater, but I thought it was a blown heater, IT could be a design thing, i guess. [/quote]

Thermocouple  is connected with body/corpus. You must have in mind if you want connect all 5 pins of pes 51

[quote author="arhi"]with that 47uF on the input?[/quote]

With condenser, becаuse interference is very large with all TK irons.

Now i will test another  driver with AC power+ moc 3063 (zero cross)

I finish second device with AC supply.

This is output signal from MCP 619 and thermocouple soldering irons. Scheme with cheap LM358 will work better ;)

---

that is nasty .. how does your Vcc looks like? how does the input from TC looks like? is the TC picking up noise or is flat? This looks very very bad. Have you tried to attach an external TC ?

Vcc is Ok, 5-10 mV voltage ripple.

Working scheme for me , i change first amp to non inverting amplifier. Now thermocouple s.irons  Ya Xun and Weller is perfect (+- 0.5C)

Maybe R13 is unnecessary too.

---

Hello, i have a problem..
Is normal that a 25w ersa stylus is more efficient of this soldering station? the tip of hakko 907(clone) fall down very quickly.
I am disappointed :-(

---

Оf course, tip  that comes with Hakko clone is very bad.

Looks like iron without cooper
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2SLuDZlYeE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2SLuDZlYeE)

---

P=3.9
I=0.1
D=0
and weller pes 51
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahCQZDvCN3g (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahCQZDvCN3g)

nice :)

btw with that iron tip, any temp control is going to be pretty useless :(

Hi,
I want to test the SID 1/5 Dp only PTC section. I populated all PCB exept two 24k resistor.
i have a "HAKKO" 907 iron with 3.6 ohm heater and 43 ohm thermoresistor.
i calibreted the PTC section as follow:
With a miliampermeter connected in place of handle PTC i adjusted CAL trimmer until rech 1 mA
Next step i connected a 100 ohm resistor in place of handle PTC and adjusted Second trimmer until reach 3V.

With a big smile on my face pass over the the next step. Connected the handle PTC on their place. heater on their place connected to 24vac, select Hakko from the menu but every time when i connect 24V and the progran load end return to "custom"..
Last time select first K type and again "hakko" go to Target and current" screen but current temperature is with negative signs also in the right and in the left side of the dot.

What i need adjust /calibrate more for hakko type handle. if exist diferent handles with diferent PTC resistence value how the soft "know" to choose what i connect ?

Verry confused

Dino

[quote author="dinoslmn"]Hi,
, select Hakko from the menu but every time when i connect 24V and the progran load end return to "custom"..
[/quote]

I have the same problem with Hakko 907, i use K type from menu and station work every time.

other recommendations:
1.refresh only second row where current temp is change.
2.In PID settings, when turn and hold down button, numbers must be increaase or descrease for example by one hundred, because if you cnahge soldering iron with new parameters, you will need more one hour to change PID settings.

dino there is a bug in firmware that reads temp too fast and reads a wrong temp so it sends you to custom. the solution is to either fix firmware (I will do this in next few weeks, now I really have no time to play with electronics) or to remove a capacitor that filters the input and that cause initial oscillations that get AD to read data incorrectly.

So the fastest option is to remove C13 (on DP schematic, or C9 on my original schematic). This will eliminate the osculations at the start and the problem of reading wrong value.

hope this helps

Thank Arhi and dtmf
I will test.

Hi,

Please make a short explain about P,I and D parameters.
How to change and which effect have each one?
Thanks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PID_controller (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PID_controller)

P is proportional part of the equation - it looks how far you are from the target and apply proportional force to get back on track, if you only use P you will have large overshoot and low stability (you know how beginner drivers drive car so they over steer both left/right and takes them a while to get back straight after a curve)

I is integrative part of the equation - it looks for how big error is from the last measurement (so area under the curve, not only amplitude but also duration is measured)

D is derivative part of the equation - it looks how fast the error is changing and predicts future

for more, read wiki article, it's pretty good.

Configuring PID coefficients require some knowledge and experience but there are some procedures that can get you where you wanna be. For e.g. Ziegler–Nichols procedure gets you to turn off I and D and setup P so that you have for a minimal P value a stable oscillation of the resulting value (so for e.g. for target 200C you have stable oscillation of temperature going 190 to 215C) then you measure frequency of the oscillation and use a formula to derive P, I and D values from this initial minimal P that gets you into stable oscillation mode. There are number of other procedures to tune the pid loop, google for them. ZN method is kinda simplest (explanation and formulas are available on the same wiki article I linked)

Hi!
I have problems with this soldering station.  I have a Hakko 907 clone with 57 ohm. The display does not change from 61 ohm, see picture.  I've calibrated at 1mA and 3v. Do I need to adjust other parameters in the display?

---

when you select sensor to be "hakko original" - does it work ?

when I select "RTD Hakko", the LED lights up and flashes a few seconds, the welder a bit hot and the resistance to 101 Omh and he goes down to 61 Ohm

You can try with correct setting for P;I;D for hakko 907 clone.

[quote author="Wilpu"]when I select "RTD Hakko", the LED lights up and flashes a few seconds, the welder a bit hot and the resistance to 101 Omh and he goes down to 61 Ohm[/quote]


I have no clue what you wrote here, sorry.

you can not measure resistance while the soldering iron is in circuit

what you can do is monitor voltage on the sensor

Hello everyone! I built this project and I would like someone to tell me how to set "configuration bit" to program pic18f2550.
Thanks in advance

configuration is already in HEX

thanks!

There is a **HUGE** market for this that apparently no one has realized!!!  As we grow older, we often accumulate pre-cancerous skin lesions. The MDs have various names depending on what they look like, but their stories are almost always the same - their genomes have been severely clobbered. Most cells with clobbered genomes promptly die, but a few survive because nothing vital to their normal operation has been blown. However, nearly all of them are unable to repair minor damage or operate outside of normal conditions. Most doctors don't like to remove them unless they look REALLY bad, because they do so much damage in hacking them off.

However, you can SLIGHTLY burn them - like about a 2-day sunburn, and most of them will be unable to repair the minor damage and will promptly die, all without killing a single healthy cell. I have done this on a larger scale by exposing areas having may such lesions to a heat lamp for just enough to redden the area for a couple of days. However, this won't work for mouth and other areas that aren't openly accessible to a heat lamp. Lasers work for dark growths, but are too poorly controlled for uncolored growth, and are pretty much unusable for white growths.

What seems to be needed is direct contact heating, to somewhere around 120F.

Can this board control an iron down to 110F, for potential use on skin lesions?

Steve

it is a pretty simple temperature controller / heater driver, the part you need to make is a heater and sensor but the board can drive a heater + sensor easily and keep temperature very precise (depending on you heater really) ... so for e.g. you can have a piece of aluminum or copper attached to a heater with thermocouple mounted to the plate (copper is better as the temperature will be more even on the plate) and then you select the temp you want your copper plate to be at and then "burn" yourself with it

Hi everyone. What kind of PIC was used in V1.5??? What is PIC18F2_28?
Thanks in advance.

Also, if someone can to share Gerber file for PCB V1.5?

http://dangerous-prototypes-open-hardwa ... iver.V1.5/ (http://dangerous-prototypes-open-hardware.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/Soldering%20Iron%20Driver/hardware/SolderinIronDriver.V1.5/)

Thank you so much.
 And which PIC is used? 2550 or...

It's something smaller, not 2550. May be SCH for V1.5?

I newer fully assembled it, but I bought 2550 for this based on earlier discussions..

Ok. Thanks again.

Hi

I have a zd931 but im not satisfied about this solders station, i have decided to replace the motherboard with your driver.
I want to use the internal transformer, doest it will works?

-pic- i cant post a link to the image :)

How do i will wire it? is it indifferent?
GND to AC24!!-1
12V to nothing
24V to AC24!!-2

I see an usb port, how i will upload the firmware with the pc? Do i need a programmer?

Thanks and sorry for this noob questions :)

Hello All,
Any one know EP5 soldering Iron? Witch kind of sensor have ?

---

that on the picture is SOLOMON soldering iron, uses thermocouple

[quote author="andrea"]I have a zd931 but im not satisfied about this solders station[/quote]

changing the driver will not help you much

[quote author="andrea"]Do i need a programmer?[/quote]

yes

I'm planing to use weller PES51 with DP 1.5 board. So I'd like someone to make sure i got this right. Is this correct:
 - PES51 is thermocouple
 - R4,21,23,38,22,24 CAL,RV2, T2, IC2, C4,14,25 can therefore be left unpopulated
 - MOC3043 can be replaced with MOC3041 if R19 is replaced with 300R resistor

What about NTC? Do i need it? Which one? Should I just solder it to the board or put it somewhere? (that part with ntc is what I really don't get)

Also, does someone have PES51 at hand, i'd like to see a picture of connector (or if anyone knows where to buy one, with international shipping).

[quote author="marvin"]I'm planing to use weller PES51 with DP 1.5 board. So I'd like someone to make sure i got this right. Is this correct:
 - PES51 is thermocouple
 - R4,21,23,38,22,24 CAL,RV2, T2, IC2, C4,14,25 can therefore be left unpopulated
 - MOC3043 can be replaced with MOC3041 if R19 is replaced with 300R resistor
[/quote]

You do not need to "sensor amplifier" section .. not sure what schematic are you looking

[quote author="marvin"]
What about NTC? Do i need it? Which one? Should I just solder it to the board or put it somewhere? (that part with ntc is what I really don't get)
[/quote]

the NTC is to measure temperature of the board, whichever one you use you need to modify firmware for it. If you don't have NTC then you only have temp of the iron as difference from ambient temp and not absolute temperature

note that this board works nice but the firmware is not for those that don't understand how things work and how to adapt it

[quote author="arhi"][quote author="marvin"]I'm planing to use weller PES51 with DP 1.5 board. So I'd like someone to make sure i got this right. Is this correct:
 - PES51 is thermocouple
 - R4,21,23,38,22,24 CAL,RV2, T2, IC2, C4,14,25 can therefore be left unpopulated
 - MOC3043 can be replaced with MOC3041 if R19 is replaced with 300R resistor
[/quote]

You do not need to "sensor amplifier" section .. not sure what schematic are you looking[/quote]
The shematic from 1st page of this topic :)

[quote author="arhi"]the NTC is to measure temperature of the board, whichever one you use you need to modify firmware for it. If you don't have NTC then you only have temp of the iron as difference from ambient temp and not absolute temperature[/quote]
Ah, right.

I just purchased this board today.  Looking forward to populating it once I get all of the parts.  Looking to use the Weller PES51 as well.

I like this one better

http://www.eosystems.ro/index.php/projects/esol (http://www.eosystems.ro/index.php/projects/esol)

[quote author="mikestefoy"]I like this one better

http://www.eosystems.ro/index.php/projects/esol (http://www.eosystems.ro/index.php/projects/esol)[/quote]

it's a nice project but can't drive PES51

Would anyone know what kind of connector the Weller PES51 Soldering pencil uses?  I am remiss to cut the end of the connector off of the pencil if I can use a bulkhead connector.  I have emailed weller (Apex Tools) just moments ago with the same inquire with little hope of receiving a valid response back.

Hi everybody,

I just finished soldering everything together and I have a problem.
When I turn it on, pwr led starts and display backlight starts but I don't see almost anything else on the display (I get couple of some strange dots in the beginning but they disappear after couple of seconds). Where should I start looking?
I didn't connected any soldering iron to the board yet.

[quote author="Aleksej"]Hi everybody,

I just finished soldering everything together and I have a problem.
When I turn it on, pwr led starts and display backlight starts but I don't see almost anything else on the display (I get couple of some strange dots in the beginning but they disappear after couple of seconds). Where should I start looking?
I didn't connected any soldering iron to the board yet.[/quote]

follow the pre-calibration procedure before you get any iron attached.
check the lcd contrast pot you should be able to see tekst.
if there is nothing displayed on the lcd even if you turn pot max to min then

0. check 5V rail going to 18f2550, see what voltage you have there and if you have a scope check ripple there too
1. check if you can read back what you wrote to the 18f2550 to see if you programmed it correctly
2. check traces to xtal and loading caps
3. check decoupling cap on the 18f2550
4. check traces and solder points from 18f2550 to lcd

when I turn contrast pot nothing happens

0. on pin 20 I have 5.05V, I don't have scope, so I can't see the noise.
1. I think it's ok

here is the video of the problem:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0--sUPe1io (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0--sUPe1io)

lot of buttons :D
that video is weird :(
the "boxes" you get before lcd is initialised, when they are gone it looks like lcd got initi string but then the "dancing" that's strange. I see only few wires going to lcd, did you ground the unused data lines on lcd (d0-d3)? How fast is that lcd? did you maybe try different brand? The firmware is running with RW pin grounded so I'm not testing busy flag but I have a delay. I did that because I designed this to go with some COG display's I have that does not support busy flag (their RW pin is N/C) but maybe the delay in firmware is too short for your lcd. Increasing delay would be easiest way to go. If you can compile the firmware yourself, get it from http://sourceforge.net/p/arhimed-sid/code/HEAD/tree/ (http://sourceforge.net/p/arhimed-sid/code/HEAD/tree/) and edit LCD.c changing

/* SAFE
#define LCD_DELAY_LONG() Delay10KTCYx(48) //delay_ms(40)
#define LCD_DELAY() Delay10KTCYx(19) //delay_ms(16)
#define LCD_DELAY_F() Delay10KTCYx(5) //delay_ms(4)
#define LCD_DELAY_SHORT() Delay10TCYx(5) //delay_us(4)
*/
#define LCD_DELAY_LONG() Delay10KTCYx(48)
#define LCD_DELAY() Delay10KTCYx(1)
#define LCD_DELAY_F() Delay10KTCYx(20)
#define LCD_DELAY_SHORT() Delay10TCYx(5) 

to:

#define LCD_DELAY_LONG() Delay10KTCYx(48) //delay_ms(40)
#define LCD_DELAY() Delay10KTCYx(19) //delay_ms(16)
#define LCD_DELAY_F() Delay10KTCYx(5) //delay_ms(4)
#define LCD_DELAY_SHORT() Delay10TCYx(5) //delay_us(4)
/* UNSAFE but fast
#define LCD_DELAY_LONG() Delay10KTCYx(48)
#define LCD_DELAY() Delay10KTCYx(1)
#define LCD_DELAY_F() Delay10KTCYx(20)
#define LCD_DELAY_SHORT() Delay10TCYx(5) 
*/

recompile and you should have it working with slow lcd's.
You can even make LCD_DELAY() longer if this is still too fast for your lcd

Many lcd require a negative voltage on this pin, sounds like you have one of those.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

I don't think it's the negative voltage on contrast problem as if you look at video
- in the beginning he sees squares in one line (so his contrast is more/less ok)
~7sec he restart it - blank screen (ok)
~14sec he press some button and screen start to dance ?!?!?!

that is garbage going into lcd, the initialization did not go properly and then data that is sent to lcd is making the weird waving .. first thing to do is set those lcd_delay things to slower, if that does not work few other things could be tried (the strobe_e macro)

Well I wasn't sure which one I need so I put them all there :D

All 16 wires from lcd are connected to the board, and I have tried with different lcd, it's the same.
One LCD is from Seeedstudio and the other is from ebay, so I don't believe that's a problem, I'm big beginner and I'm sure I did some really stupid mistake, but I can't find it by myself, I checked everything couple of times already.

I will try that what you suggested

Hi everyone,

Would anyone be kind enough to post an uptodate BOM with Arhi's corrections please? I have skimmed through the forum, compared the Eagle BOM export with DP's BOM and now have myself bit confused.

I'm on my second board and would like to get it right this time.

Thanks in advance,

Tested soldering irons

Hakko 900 series, and clones (PTC sensor)
HAKKO 907 iron
HAKKO 908 iron
QUICK 907A iron (HAKKO clone, different characteristics of the sensor)
GORDAK iron (HAKKO clone, different characteristics of the sensor)
ATTEN iron (HAKKO clone, different characteristics of the sensor)
NONAME HAKKO clone (identical RTD characteristics)
Solomon SL/HQ irons (Thermocouple sensor
SOLOMON SL 10
SOLOMON HQ 10
SOLOMON HQ 30
Weller PES51 (Thermocouple sensor)

Hi guys
There is another Hakko clone soldering iron with thermocouple sensor produced by Quick.  I found out to late after two irons burned out. I have a quick 702B station and two quick 936A soldering stations. The 702B have a iron with thermistor sensor and the 936A have iron with thermocouple sensor. They have the same connections and connecting plug and look exactly the same. Thus over time the wrong irons with thermocouple got plugged into the 702B (thermistor driver) with the result that the heating elements overheated and burned as there was no protection and thus no control. The only way to distinguish between the irons  is to measure the sensor and mark the irons. See my crude markings

Therefore I have to now rebuild my drivers to accommodate both thermocouple or thermistor.  The only question is how to select the correct sensor in auto.

My picture are "invalid". Will start a new post soon with all details.

Hi all,

It is not clear to me how to connect an encoder to the pcb. I have an encoder with a button. Could someone give me some guidance?

Thanks

any chance this will support the t12 tips

nope, no support for T12 on this driver ... few members made a driver for T12 but they didn't share the schematic nor the code

I believe sparkybg has released v1 of his design and will release the second soon.

T12 is simple to interface. Connect 24v to heat the element. Disconnect and read out the thermocouple. The third terminal is for esd connection. I will release soon a simple design for t12 tips.

yes I missed that one ... viewtopic.php?f=56&t=5264&hilit=t12 (http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=5264&hilit=t12)

Thanks for this great project. I found others, but this seems the most complete.

I like the Hakko FX-888D, but I dislike some stuff:
- Lack of a proper knob, too much stuff in too few buttons.
- More functions in more buttons.
- The thermocouple isn't at the top of the tip. Are there some that are at the top instead of the bottom?
- Does it feature autodisconnect? I forget the soldering iron connected very frequently, as I forget other things.
- Am I pessimistic about Hakko FX-888D? Is the temperature sensor good enough?

I did read...

If you used a metcal iron, there wouldn't be any need (or control) for setting or calibrating temperature. The iron simply works :-)

And that's when the fight started.

- What about having too few buttons? Are there mods for it?

If I'm able to get my own cheap DIY soldering station, it will help practice soldering and making PCBs.

[quote author="Sjaak"]I believe sparkybg has released v1 of his design and will release the second soon.

T12 is simple to interface. Connect 24v to heat the element. Disconnect and read out the thermocouple. The third terminal is for esd connection. I will release soon a simple design for t12 tips.[/quote]

BTW here is a simple chinese design: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/in ... grated-tip (http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/interesting-936-to-t12-(fx951-integrated-tip))-conversion/msg233835/#msg233835

Hi, I am currently assembling this board and I am thinking about using these components:

LM385Z/NOPB for IC2
2N3904 for T1
2N3906 for T2

Should they be ok?

[quote author="arhi"]Guillermo, I suggest you don't waste time with DP v1.0 as you should have already received the 3.1.4 version of mine board that is tested, works with both HAKKO and Weller, Solomon and has firmware that works. DP v1.0 is not tested, is known to have few bugs and there's no firmware for it.... So why waste time with it when you have the pcb that works (I assume it arrived to Italy by now since the post office said it will definitely left the country on January 9th the latest)?

DP version 1.5 is compatible with mine 3.1.4 (schematic is identical) so the firmware also works 1/1 and is also tested and works... (kudos to Filip for making a 100% trough hole version on 8x8cm board with separated grounds and all in all GREAT PCB design, I like the DP 1.5 version way more then mine 3.1.4)[/quote]

hope latest fw still works with DP 1.5 board

Hi
I almost finished soldering all components on Patrick's board.
This is my encoder from Ebay.
How do i connect this encoder to Patrick's board?
Thank you!

---

what patricks board?

this one
http://dangerousprototypes.com/2012/10/ ... -at-seeed/ (http://dangerousprototypes.com/2012/10/22/soldering-iron-driver-v1-5-pcbs-are-available-at-seeed/)

how's that "patrick's" board? The schematic is made by me and pcb is made by arakis (filip)?

as for connecting it, connect common pin and one of the button pins to ground
connect A and B from encoder to E1 and E2 (if the rotation in firmware is contrary to what you expect change E1 and E2) and connect the other button pin to EB

my error
but from this page i presume that Patrick is the one who made the board.
http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Pat ... evelopment (http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Patrick:_Soldering_iron_driver_v1_development)
Thank you for you help.

don't remember, maybe "patrick" was the codename of dp's version of the sid at the time ..

Here I'm!
I'm starting build this project!
Greetings from Italy

for pic programming should I use a parallel programmer find in fox delta site?
Thanks!

Hello,  i order board from Speed Studio and asamble with all parts but i do ot know how to connect the 2x16 LCD to the board. Witch pin go to witch pin on board?

I have this LCD (JHD162G)

i have this pin

1   2   3   4   5   6   7   8   9   1   11   12   13   14   15   16
Vss   VDD   V0   RS   R/W   E   DB0   DB1   DB2   DB3   DB4   DB5   DB6   DB7   LEDA   LEDK

Also please help with pic18F2550 i have flash the file SID_GEN4.X.production.hex is this correct file?

And do i need to flash some other IC on the board?

Sorry for so much question but i am reading this forums for days and cannot find answer.

i connected LCD but i have only this at screen.
[attachment=0]

---

Hello to all

I have one noob question about capacitors and sorry for my bad english and some mistakes.
I need some information for capacitors voltage. Some capacitors are explained, but the other still not sure what the minimum voltage required to support. Here I put a list, so if someone can write that voltage.

C1, C2, C3, C15, C23
C5, C6
C7-C21, C25 (C25 is twice mentioned in the list, C17 = 50V)
C13

That is all.

Please help and thanks.

[quote author="dolino"]Hello to all

I have one noob question about capacitors and sorry for my bad english and some mistakes.
I need some information for capacitors voltage. Some capacitors are explained, but the other still not sure what the minimum voltage required to support. Here I put a list, so if someone can write that voltage.

C1, C2, C3, C15, C23
C5, C6
C7-C21, C25 (C25 is twice mentioned in the list, C17 = 50V)
C13

That is all.

Please help and thanks.[/quote]

I think that maximum voltage that can be is 25-30V
small  ceramic capacitor that i use is 50V like this
http://http://www.aliexpress.com/item/100pcs-lot-Multilayer-ceramic-capacitor-1uF-105-50V-1000nF-105M/32455164152.html?ws_ab_test=searchweb201556_9_79_78_77_80%2Csearchweb201644_5%2Csearchweb201560_6&spm=2114.01020208.3.11.ltYWYB

Great, thank you