http://iteadstudio.com/service/ultra-lo ... tart-at-5/ (http://iteadstudio.com/service/ultra-low-cost-pcb-prototyping-start-at-5/)
It seems like they want to offer a 5USD prototyping service for 5 PCB (5x5 cm), with slightly reduced specs (8mils, no e-test, longer lead time). They are also introducing 10x10 at 15USD and 10x5 at 10USD. Awesome! I really didn't needed 10 copies most of times.
Will Seeed introduce the same offers in the next days, as they are ITead customers?
tinito
Cool. I bet they do compete with this new deal.
Seeed and ITead both get boards from teh same place.
Uh, i though ITead was Seeed supplier.. do you know the name of the PCB manufacturer?
[quote author="tinito"]offer a 5USD prototyping service for 5 PCB (5x5 cm)[/quote]
niiiiiiiiice ... why the hack they don't add a ccard payment (/me hates paypal)
No, but it is a big prototyping fab in Schenzhen. ITead is a small shop, I don't think they are in the PCB fab business.
Pretty cool. Sadly everything I do attempts to meet RoHS so no lead, which means the 10 dollar is really 15 for my stuff, and this would be 100% more for the lead free HASL (unless they change that part of the price structure).
[quote author="brian"]Pretty cool. Sadly everything I do attempts to meet RoHS so no lead, which means the 10 dollar is really 15 for my stuff, and this would be 100% more for the lead free HASL (unless they change that part of the price structure).[/quote]
This 5boards service is for prototyping really, not for final board... and for prototyping I don't c really a point to go with RoHS ... it's harder to work with, it's more expensive and it is more dangerous to your health (yes, RoHS is without lead but with all other stuff that kills ya)... not to mention it kills the life of your soldering iron (as you have to run it hotter and use more aggressive flux) and soldering is never fun as no lead flux don't flow nicely and form those nasty spikes that make all kind of troubles on high frequencies ..
I'm all for RoHS for the final product but for prototype, I want it fast and cheap .. just my 0.02
Arhi:
What part of a RoHS solder or other parts do you think is bad for you?
I use NXG1 solder paste so the iron is only used for rework. Sn96.5Ag3.0Cu0.5, none of those are really harmful to anyone. The flux is not good but it isn't very different from the flux in lead solder.
For rework flux I normally use less aggressive stuff than Ian though I do like the same type of gel flux he uses (since he is using Pb as far as I know it seems the flux is equal also). I often use 951 flux for minor rework on my boards, which as Ian points out is not aggressive at all.
The peak temperature for NXG1 vs EP-256HA is only 25 C more or 10%. Which is not a big deal either for my iron or my hot plate.
I find working lead free is something people say is a lot harder and actually isn't any harder other than rework where the oxides are a bit more troublesome.
Proper prototyping for production requires lead free to understand any reflow issues.
If we look at the MSDS for NXG1 we find it is a <1,1,0> if we look at EP-256HA we find it is a <2,1,0>. Clearly the governmental authorities feel you are not factually correct and that leaded solder is more of a health risk to use. I strongly urge people to go lead free not just for your health but for the environmental impact.
Your project doesn't end when you are done making it, it ends when it is properly disposed of.
Those are my 2 cents.
[quote author="brian"]
I find working lead free is something people say is a lot harder and actually isn't any harder other than rework where the oxides are a bit more troublesome.
Proper prototyping for production requires lead free to understand any reflow issues.
[/quote]
i have the same opinions, anything that goes into production should be prototyped in a manner that it will be mass produced
[quote author="brian"]
Your project doesn't end when you are done making it, it ends when it is properly disposed of.
[/quote]
The same can be said where it begins, your projects have sources much farther beyond a digikey order.
[quote author="brian"]
What part of a RoHS solder or other parts do you think is bad for you?
[/quote]
the fumes are bad, I don't have problem with fumes from normal solder, but RoHS kills my eyes and pinches my nose.. no idea what's inside, maybe I just used some improper stuff before. But take into account that I assume prototyping is not just "get one piece and put in the oven" as I usually have to rework a board many times in the dev process, unsolder and resolder many parts etc etc... the part where you "put the paste on and shove it into oven" is same no matter what type of solder you use
[quote author="brian"]I find working lead free is something people say is a lot harder and actually isn't any harder other than rework where the oxides are a bit more troublesome. [/quote]
maybe the problem is with the right tools and right supplies. I have the iron that is ok for lead free but all the solder wire I tried is awful .. does not wet or smells seriously bad .. never found one that wets and can be inhaled without my throat closing
[quote author="brian"]
Proper prototyping for production requires lead free to understand any reflow issues.
[/quote]
I agree 1000000000% there's just one huge difference, I prototype for myself, not for "production" as a typical hobbyist. That is what I understand this PCB "ultra low prototyping service" is about. If I'd develop something for production I'd probably have some deadlines and every single limit on this service would not work for me - no e-check at all, 8/8 instead 6/6, long processing time ... it's definitely not for a "company work", but for mine "I wanna check if this works" - it is great.
[quote author="brian"]
If we look at the MSDS for NXG1 we find it is a <1,1,0> if we look at EP-256HA we find it is a <2,1,0>. Clearly the governmental authorities feel you are not factually correct and that leaded solder is more of a health risk to use. I strongly urge people to go lead free not just for your health but for the environmental impact.
[/quote]
wrt environment if you are disposing your stuff properly I don't see a problem with lead. It gets recycled even in shitty countries like the one I live in (they can't save the gold from electronics but they do extract lead :D )... so I don't see the effect on environment to be problematic. I might be wrong but for now I rather use those few $$ I save for not going lead free to take the trip once every few month to the recycle plant and take all the junk I have there :D (they still don't "collect" stuff, you need to take it there .. idiotic country what can I say, I need 1h drive if I don't want to throw my batteries into "regular" trash so I collect all the stuff and make a trip every now and then when the amount of junk becomes large enough :D).
[quote author="sqkybeaver"]The same can be said where it begins, your projects have sources much farther beyond a digikey order.[/quote]
now that's really something I "do not want to" / "cannot" worry about. If ppl want to make their 3yo kids wind coils to get the price of the inductors down, I really don't have a way to fight against it...
[quote author="sqkybeaver"]
The same can be said where it begins, your projects have sources much farther beyond a digikey order.[/quote]
I concur and to the extent I am able I will source things well. I am concerned about not knowing the environmental conditions or labor conditions of the PCB houses most of all.
If companies were to note these things it would be weighted into my choice of whom I pick as a supplier.