Fair point. This is up to the user, though - if this is a concern, they can reduce the voltage to 24V, or jump through the necessary hoops to use approved wiring.[/quote]
Good day Nick,
Agreed. However, some users may not be aware of these issues and simply forge ahead without any regard and may get themselves into something serious. Perhaps a cautionary notice on the designs may be a good idea?
[quote author="nickjohnson"]Agreed, I'm convinced. Let's make a max of 36v official.[/quote]
Good day All,
Just a heads up, but I think anything over 30V would be considered Class 1 device/wiring... which means the wiring, device enclosure, etc is considered a shock and fire hazard and so would require all of the nuances (approvals, wire sizes, wire markings, ratings, etc) associated with line voltage (i.e. 120VAC, etc) equipment.
Communicates in good English - not some Google-translated Chinglish.
Replies within a few hours - not a few days
Supports up to 30x30 cm pcbs
Cheaper than Seeed on boards larger than 5x5cm
Does V-scoring on demand (but at a rather high cost, so only good for 100-500 pcs)
Does stainless steel soldermasks for less than half of the Seeed price
Ships by Fedex for about 1/3'rd of Seeeds courier shipping prices
I've sent 23 different designs to them inclusive a medium sized batch of 500 with V-scoring. And been happy with all the boards except for one where they forgot the extra stopmasks I added to the board. But they re-manufactured the pcb in two days and Fedexed it to me, so just four days after I complained I had the corrected boards in my hand.
The only thing I'll use Seeed for now is the Laser cutting service, but that's only until I purchase my own.[/quote]
Good day Matseng,
Can you tell me what their typical PCB turn around time is? I cannot seem to find it on their site.
[quote author="Chuckt"]<snip> Is there a voltage regulator in there? I'm wondering how they divide the voltage for the cable.
Or would I be better off paying the $70 for a cable instead of making it myself? The email I got from Champion was also confusing because they also say the generator only outputs 25 amps which might sound right since generators are under performing what they are rated at.[/quote]
Good day Chuck,
The cable within your link is simply a 3 conductor (Hot, Neutral, and Ground) 10 gauge wire (rated for outdoor/wet use, etc) with a specialty plug on one end and three standard receptacles (molded as single block) on the other. The receptacles are simply wired in parallel. Can you make one? Sure, but then it will not be UL rated, etc and so there would be a liability risk (i.e. shock, fire, etc) associated with it.
Why is it pricey? Probably because this cable is a specialty item and so production volumes are low and so the manufacturer is forced to amortize the development, testing, approval (i.e. UL), insurance, profit, and initial manufacturing costs (i.e. the design/tooling for the molded ends, etc) over a much lower volume... thus more $$$. I am not justifying their price, but just pointing out a number of the additional costs that are above the actual part's cost.
There are various types of the 3D printing process where some are better suited for visual and others for physical (i.e. drilling, tapping holes, etc). In my case I went with a FDM ABS process, as I needed a 3D print that could be machined, etc... I used http://www.buildparts.com/ and they were very fast (i.e. 24-48 hours hours) and relatively inexpensive (< $300) given the 2-part complexity of my design. The resulting 3D print was very strong and was tolerated physical machining, etc at the expense of having a slightly rough surface texture.
Good day All, US and other Countries routinely open and inspect parcels randomly. Given the number of packages entering a country they cannot inspect them all and so periodically randomly inspect some. This applies even to UPS, Fed Ex, etc and other commercial shippers too. Obviously Customs is looking for nasty stuff, but also for parcels where the value is purposely declared lower than its true value in order to minimize taxes. Cheers, Sam
I got an injection mold for a hand-held case done in 1999 and it cost about £30K (GBP), I would be interested in seeing if the costs have come down since then[/quote]
Good day Tony,
Indeed, prices have come down tremendously... You can get the injection molding tooling done from as a low as $3000 USD, but is highly dependent upon your design, tooling material, etc. As for the actual design (Solidworks)... this too is extremely variable. That being said given what it cost you in 1999, I would say the entire process can be done for 10% to 20% of what you paid.
I would still get a quote from Protomold, etc as my numbers are about 2-3 years old and so they could have made their process more competitive. Submitting a quote is easy once your have your 3D design... simply upload your file and you will receive your quote promptly. The issue for me was the cost per unit and the recurring setup fee... Going with the injection molding process was excellent and surprisingly it only took about 6 weeks (once my design was done of course) before I had enclosures...
As for the 3D printed enclosures... I think the technology is just not there yet for production enclosures that can match injection molding in terms of per unit cost and durability, etc. I could be wrong though, as I have only been monitoring the 3D technology on the periphery. If you do find a 3D process/technology that would be a suitable replacement for injection molding please let me know!
I can't remember the specifics, but I think it was about 10x the cost... Injection molded parts around $0.5 each and Protomold somewhere around $5 a piece ... This was a while ago and so maybe Protomold has reduced their price differential. In my case looking at the NRE costs and the per unit cost, it just made a lot better economically going injection molded... and I had a lot more parts as well. I do not recall the Protomold's setup fee, but it was certainly more than $1500... somewhere close to $2500 for my design (2-part enclosure)... and this was a recurring setup fee per order.
I never did try their FirstCut or other services, as the 3D printing I was getting suited my needs very well and was faster and cheaper. Secondly I have access to a fairly big Industrial CNC and specialty machinist if I needed to make some pricer CNC parts ... which I have done as well.
On a secondary note, I am simply amazed at how much time and effort I spend looking at off the shelf enclosures for various projects. I wish I had some extra $$$, as I would just create 3-4 standard enclosure styles and have them all injection molded. The quality, finish, and fitment of injection mold enclosures cannot really be beat (at its price point and with a well engineered) and the per-unit cost is crazy low.
A few years I looked at this and found that the 3D printed models are really only suited for prototyping/verification. Some 3D processes are better suited for visible models only while others can be physically modified... Sadly, the modifiable ones have surface textures, etc and so do not look overly pretty. FWIW the 3D printing (the version I could physically modify) I had done was rather cheap... like $200 (total) for a 2-piece enclosure with 24 hour turn-around.
That being said, I did talk to a company called ProtoMold (http://www.protomold.com and http://www.protolabs.com), etc and they offered options for those that did not want to go through the entire injection mold process. Personally I found both methods rather pricey for what they offered and I just went with the injection molding process.
[quote author="bearmos"]that's all pretty exciting - hopefully you''ll have the PnP up and running in your own shop quickly! It's great to have all the manuals available with the machine - I'm sure they'll come in handy.[/quote]
Good day Bearmos,
Indeed, it is pretty exciting... and scary too in a way, as there is a lot of know... Hopefully my training was absorbed. Luckily the original owner, who I purchased the unit from, has offered to provide me remote setup assistance/training as I need. This is a huge help and really reflects the character of the owner. A true gentleman in all sense of the word. Sadly it will be several weeks before I am ready to "jump" in, as I have a lot of other stuff on the go... plus I have yet to get my reflow and stencil printer sorted. However, there is certainly something empowering knowing that I can now do a whole lot more myself ... like prototyping my BGA designs... I no longer have to bug my CM for a favor to mount a few BGAs to my test boards... or making a number of prototypes rather quickly (if one ignores the setup effort) and to a much higher level... Lastly, there is the entertainment value... For some unknown reason to me I find there is something entertaining/mesmorizing of watching a CNC machine working away :)
For those that might be interested, here are some pics of the (older) Commercial Juki/Zevatech that I recently purchased. It is a sizeable unit and it took two good size crates to transport the machine and the associated accessories to me... 2 crates weighing 1700 lbs total and were roughly 50" square x 5' high... Crating was not cheap and was actually more than the entire transport cost! I also included a picture of the manuals... about 10 of them ranging from training, parts, user,operating, etc... Although the original owner trained me on the unit, there is a lot to know and given how many manuals there are... I suspect I will be reading for quite a while...
Just an update. I continue to experience problems with this machine. It has turned into a HUGE headache. When it works it's not bad but it just has so many problems it takes more time fixing the machine every other board then just doing them by hand. By fixing I mean it constantly drops parts, CONSTANTLY gets stuck advancing tape, and placement is not very accurate even with large components. I'm so frustrated right now I have literally screamed out loud. I'm seeking a refund, if I can't get one I'm looking to sell this piece of garbage.
Sooo depressed, Xinort[/quote]
Good day Xinort,
Yikes...Just a few thoughts... If the unit is dropping parts check to see if you can use a larger nozzle... The bigger the nozzle should allow more "strength" to hold the parts. As for PCB registration/inaccuracies... Can you somehow slow down the machine? Perhaps it is missing some of its encoder signals (or whatever it uses for location feedback) and so slowing down the machine may allow some level of positional recovery? Lastly, I would contact the manufacturer to see if there is a firmware update... you never know, perhaps a firmware update may minimize some of the issues you are seeing.
