[quote author="sparkybg"]The oscillogram only depends on hardware. Firmware/hex file has nothing to do with it. Firmware only depends on the signal on that terminal in order to work properly. No matter if it starts or not, it still will not work properly if the oscillogram is not right - it will switch the power on and off at the wrong moments, and the measurements of the temperature will be taken at the wrong moment.[/quote] there we go
------------------------------ first hex was writen by my friend because i does not have pickit3 programmer after arrived i checked it just start + make one beep and nothing + previous oscilogram was made from that circuit so for now you got the oscilogram by according to my notes in last post everything is working just the case is with VTC1 amplifier there is something wrong because the rising/faliing temp. shouldnt changed by variabling the calibration potentiometers never sure my pcb could have a big glitch in circtuit :) why not but the @equalizer video did confirm my case he is use original pcb from yours project now look to @equalizer youtube video you will coinformation to my posts about these temperature jumps depend on VTC1 setup it shouldnt never happen in that design , then no idea where is the error maybe is working for you fine and maybe there is error with some parts on schematic for my understanding if by variabling VTC1 you wanna change the amplify range but in fact you change not only it but also the div time of frame between heating up tip and reading its details from its TC then that output circuit with amplifier working completly wrong also i am just amateur maybe someone other in that thread could his own opinion about that :)
[quote author="sparkybg"]Both trimmers are just changing the gain of the amplifiers, nothing more. And yes, they are for calibration.
And yes, on some tips it jumps sometimes, but after some time (5-10 seconds) it must go and stay near the set temperature.
In you have changed something on the PCB, it can be a ground loop or something. I cannot comment anything but my design which i have working prototype of. Very small changes in the design, if not made properly, can cause problems with the ground loops an so on. And because you are measuring microvolts, these ground loops can cause even bigger jumps.
Again, if the oscillogram on the terminal I posted some posts ago is not looking like on my picture, sometihng is wrong. Did you corrected it. The whole controller depends on it.[/quote] there was a oscillogram from wrong hex file after i arrived pickit3 programmer i fastly writen it , it just start + beep and nothing more after after i found second hex file write it and station run so maybe these hex files also wrong and need to compille a whole of code myself no idea there are two PIC18_C18 and PIC18_XC8 :) but no matter , i am beginner with oscilloscope measurments i will connect now on PB3 point with it when station is working and make that measurment also
ok i found the main problem i could say the problem could be in my pcb design which is diffrent than @sparkybg but by comparing @equalizor videos i see the problem is here and here so the calibration of VTC1 potentiometer working completly crazy than it should , why because lets say is calibration potentiometer of thermocouple then when i screw it to wrong position the station will display wrong temperature (not equal to the reall one) for example there will be there 250C but station will display 350C - right ? when i screw it to correct position it will display reall temp according to the tip temp. - this i have tested on crap chinese hakko T12 clone BAKON 950D everything is fine and correct and the jump of rising/failing offset is maximum +3 -3C like it should - same situation happend on VTC2 calibration for tips with separated thermocouple like 936 937 any of them calibration working perfect and temperature jumps are beetwen +3 -3C no matter on which position there is potentiometer setup it could be wrong setup or correct no matter now where is the case: by screwing the VTC1 thermocouple calibration potentiometer (is this reall calibration potentiometer ?) the temperature jumps changing drastically by depend on potentiometer setup for example: we setup 350C on VTC1 but the reall temperature of tip is 250C - now when it reach that point it start jumping +10-50-100C -10-50-100C , then if we setup it near reall temp 250C then it jumps with its temperature from beetwen +10 -10C then if nearest temperature reached 1:1 equally to reall temp. then the jumps of temperatures stated below! but in fact even with precise potentiometer we cant reach minimum temp. jumps equal to the crap chinese hakko T12 clone +3 -3C ;) station why ? and why these crazy things with calibration happend no idea... by removing that tantalic capacitor from handle the temperature jumps are faster also i will record full videos soon with my tests all tests i made on externall thermocouple connected to T12 tips externally today regards
@sparkybg inside mine T12 handle there is a small tantalum capacitor soldered with power wires beetwen + and - so maybe that capacitor cause all of these problems because you said the power for T12 tips must be recifited but not filtered ? do i need to remove it ?
[quote author="sparkybg"]Do you have the oscillogram I posted? If it look drastically different from my picture, you have a sync problem, and this behavior will be a result of it.[/quote] hi previous oscilogram was from wrong hex file loaded to the station it wont display even :) after i load second and it run like it run anyway for now i does not have time to fighting with it maybe after 1 - 2 weeks i will compille firmware myself check it also i will record video how it working and put here one question to use with that station PACE TD100 handle tips do i need to modiffy something in pic code ? or it will run them correct without any modiffications ? these tips are 24V too ?
[quote author="sparkybg"]For T12, set it at 350, then leave if for a while. It will stabilize in 20-30 seconds. When you put it next time if will stabilise faster. Some T12 behave strange on first heat up. Something in the tip needs to be heated up to 350 degrees at least one time tu function properly. Also, some T12 tips show erratic behavior and cannot stabilize at all. Try another tip, better with a different shape.
For Hakko 936, if you soldered C20 and C21 on the front PCB, remove them. It should work OK after the removal. Of course, you should uncomment the "25W ordynary iron with K thermocouple" in PID.h and comment the JBC C245 section, then recompile the firmware. If it still does not work, something is wrong with the hardware.[/quote] hold on 1. (or T12, set it at 350, then leave if for a while. It will stabilize in 20-30 seconds. When you put it next time if will stabilise faster. Some T12 behave strange on first heat up. Something in the tip needs to be heated up to 350 degrees at least one time tu function properly. Also, some T12 tips show erratic behavior and cannot stabilize at all. Try another tip, better with a different shape.) answer - i testing this on genuine hakko T12 spatula tips also on chinese one like T12-I and the window of rising/falling temperature is even wider on spatula original tips than chinese T12-I it goes up to 250C and going down to 150C faster up to 250C etc. 2. when i starting screw VR1 potentiometer i changing the rising/falling time speed of temp. why ? so what the hell for VR1 and VR2 ? for calibrate the tip or calibrate the rising/falling time temperature of tip ? 3. dont play with C files and manually compille it , just the second CX8 hex files loaded from downloaded files , maybe thats the problem with these crazy things happend ? and i need to fix this: (he "25W ordynary iron with K thermocouple" in PID.h and comment the JBC C245 section) ? 4. dont puts any C20 and C21 capacitor just all is equal 1:1 to latest schematic from yours first post i just modiffy the PCB to fit on crap AOYUE 2930 case
[quote author="sparkybg"]You should get something like this on RB3:
Don't worry for C8 votage - it is completely OK. This is more or less rectified AC voltage. 24VAC means 24*1.414=34V peak voltage. When you rectify this voltage, and put a filter capacitor after the rectifier you will get 34V on this filter capacitor (less 1-2 diode drops).
The tip is not connected to C8 - it gets unfiltered rectified voltage with the same RMS votage as transformer RMS votage. C8 is there only to provide votage for the LM chip, i.e. the power of the MCU and amplifiers. It has nothing to do with the heater of the iron.[/quote] hi finally i flash correct hex file and station is working , but something is completly damaged or .. ? when i put T12 tip and setup to 250C then temperature start rising and when it reach 250C it start going up 251C 252C 258C after start going down faster from 258C 250C and when it reach center point = 250C it drastically going down very fast to 200C then 150C now... when i replace T12 handle with hakko 936 handle and when it reach for example 250C it going up and down + - 10C finally when i leave it hot and going to make coffe and back these jumps are stabilise and it jumping beetwen + - 1 - 3 C (this is happens only on 936 handle) on hakko T12 there are crazy things happend which i noticed at begin of that post i did manipulate with VR2 and found that sometimes it helps to stabilise those temperature jumps (i guess is for calibrate reall temp equall to the LED temperature showed already right ? ) by manipulating VR1 i just calibrate temp. for hakko 937 handle or maybe VR2 is for setup those temp. jumping case only ? not for calibrate.. can you help me with that ? thanks
[quote author="sparkybg"]PB3(Port B, bit 3) termnal of the MCU should have "smashed" sine wave on it with amplitude of around 3.5-3.9V.[/quote]here is capture from that point using oscilloscope width = 10.70ms feq= 50.0hz also why i got 28V on C8 capacitor if transformer have 24VAC and hakko tip should receive near that voltage too ?
[quote author="sparkybg"]Can you measure the voltage on RB3 terminal with oscilloscope?[/quote] hello sparkybg i also just finished soldering that controller , everything is connected maiboard + backboard transformer is used polish indel 24V finally when i power up it with hex loaded it beeps using buzzer for 1 second and that beeping sound going lower lower and dissapear also display is not working the pic controller got 5V supply the C8 capacitor 220uF 50V connected before LM2675M got 28V ! and also what the hell is the RB3 terminall to check ??!?!?! i have digitall oscilloscope and i can check this point too but no idea where is this point thanks
hello i think the chinese hakko T12 tips also the power supply in cloned stations have just only a half power ! than original one and even chinese on aliexpress notice about that the heating element has just 36wat , i think its thats why they did remove standby function in fx-951 clone , cause the delivered/received power is to low for rise temp. quickly when going up from standby so now lets compare the prices of T12 tips chinese vs T12 hakko , chinese cost half than original so i think better is to pay for original one original deliver 70W and heating element has 70W chinese deliver 36W and heating element has 36W ;) , so i think maximum power in fx-951 clone is around 50W from transformer
[quote author="sparkybg"][quote author="luklf01"][quote author="sparkybg"]The original tips are Hakko, not Aoyue. However, the Aoyue tips are also OK. They are a bit shorter than the original Hakko T12 tips, and the BlackJack handpiece is also a bit shorter. The difference is around 10mm. I don't remember any other differences. This controller drives them both. I have some BJ tips around also.[/quote] i understand thanks for answer , so quality as i understand is equal however aoyue spatula tips are even cheaper than chinese T12 is the pid dead time will be the same in aouye/blackjack like actually written in code ? sorry i do not have oscilloscope to check this but i will try to reconstruct full schematic of aoyue station next month and will post it here maybe will be usefull also for others this station use atmega8L i was trying to readout it but it have fuses disabled :)[/quote]
Yes, the original T12, the chinese T12 and the AOYUE T12 are all the same electrically.
Don't bother with schematic unless you are doing it out of curiosity. It works more or less the same way this controller works. And it uses cheaper and inferior components - for example the OPAMP is an old LM with 2mV offset, the DAC is usually 8 bit, the MOSFET is cheaper and so on.[/quote] ok i will make your controller soon and will modiffy some functions because aoyue use integrated motion sensor in hand for standby not like hakko use ir right? i am frustrated with aouye controller the chinese didnt place 5V beeper to the board also the station didnt save temperature setup before its going to power off its propably due to the mcu flash memory limitation also i need another second hand from aouye brand it is 60W and use old style tips and will use them both with that controller is really better than order second aouye station just for another kind of hand
[quote author="sparkybg"]The original tips are Hakko, not Aoyue. However, the Aoyue tips are also OK. They are a bit shorter than the original Hakko T12 tips, and the BlackJack handpiece is also a bit shorter. The difference is around 10mm. I don't remember any other differences. This controller drives them both. I have some BJ tips around also.[/quote] i understand thanks for answer , so quality as i understand is equal however aoyue spatula tips are even cheaper than chinese T12 is the pid dead time will be the same in aouye/blackjack like actually written in code ? sorry i do not have oscilloscope to check this but i will try to reconstruct full schematic of aoyue station next month and will post it here maybe will be usefull also for others this station use atmega8L i was trying to readout it but it have fuses disabled :)
hello @sparkybg i have few questions to you i did read that topic and saw on yours video BK3000LF station so i guess you have iron tips for it i use AOYUE 2930 which is equall to BK3000LF it use same tips but maybe electronic circuit a little diffrent my AOYUE iron tips have near 60 - 70W working excellent and have good design i do not have psychically any hakko T12 driver or even irons for compare them you build that T12/T15 controller for use with T12 tips clones so my question is simply could you compare T12 tips clones to the original AOYUE/BLACKJACK tips ? i saw chinese T12 have just 35W max and poor design